Hillary_Clinton_Forum_73

AT A BRIEFING in Brussels, NATO officials said Serb forces had driven 290,000 people out of Kosovo in the past 10 days and could clear all the ethnic Albanians from the province within 10-20 days.

Neighboring Macedonia said it was unable to cope with the wave of people trying to escape and would only allow in refugees who could move on to other countries. With another 50,000 waiting to enter, Macedonia’s top government officials said the army would prevent the illegal entry of any more refugees. “The security situation in the country could be seriously endangered because of the huge wave of refugees from Kosovo,” the Macedonian Security Council said after an all-night meeting. MORE...

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Message: The First World War started in the Balkans. The Second World War started in the Balkans. The third, and last, world war will start in the Balkans.

Name: Charlotte Crist

email: ccrist@worldnet.att.net

Message:

Name: ControlGirl

email:

Message: Yes, but will all Americans be cleared from Kosovo in 10-20 days??? That's what I really want to know.

Name:

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Message: I thought this was all about Hillary Clinton. But I guess she is not newsworthy right now, now that her husband has learned that war is fun.

Name: lesterg

email: freundlich@JUNO.com

Message: One more lesson from Bill Clinton. OK to lie. OK to cheat on your wife. OK to go to war because its all really high tech and no one on your side gets killed.

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Message: THE NEW YORK TIMES
April 1, 1999
OP-ED
These Bombs Don't Help
By Veran Matic

BELGRADE, Serbia -- The air strikes against Yugoslavia were supposed to stop the Milosevic war machine.

In fact, the bombing campaign has jeopardized the lives of more than 10 million people and set back the fledgling forces of democracy in Kosovo and Serbia.

The bombing demonstrates how powerless President Clinton and the Western alliance are to avert a human catastrophe in Kosovo. The protection of a population under threat is a noble duty, but it requires a clear strategy and a coherent endgame.

As the situation unfolds on the ground and in the air, it is apparent that there is no such strategy. Instead, each missile that hits the ground exacerbates the humanitarian disaster that NATO is supposed to be preventing.

It's not easy to stop the war machine once its power has been unleashed. Even before NATO's announcement yesterday that it would make targets of Government buildings in Belgrade, analysts were asking whether the air strikes were really about saving Kosovo Albanians. Now Serbs are doubly suspicious. Just how far are NATO members prepared to go? What happens if the war spreads? All of these terrifying questions must be answered, although I suspect that few will want to live with the historical burden of having answered them.

The same questions crowded my mind as I sat in a Belgrade prison on the first day of the NATO attack, detained for eight hours when the Government shut down my radio station. Whiling away the time in the cell I shared with a murder suspect, I asked myself what the West's aim was for "the morning after." The image of NATO taking its finger off the trigger kept coming to mind. I've seen no indication so far that gives me hope.

My friends in the West keep asking me why there is no rebellion here. Where are the people who poured onto the streets every day for three months in 1996 to demand democracy and human rights? Zoran Zivkovic, the opposition Mayor of the city of Nis, answered that the other day: "Twenty minutes ago my city was bombed. The people who live here are the same people who voted for democracy in 1996, the same people who protested for a hundred days after the authorities tried to deny them their victory in the elections. They voted for the same democracy that exists in Europe and the United States. Today my city was bombed by the democratic states of the U.S.A., Britain, France, Germany and Canada! Is there any sense in this?"

Most of these people feel betrayed by the countries that were their models.

They are now compelled to take up arms and join sons who are already serving in the army. With the bombs falling all around them, nobody can convince them that this is only an attack on their Government and not their country.

Only weeks before the air strikes began, NATO's Secretary General, Javier Solana, suggested establishing a "partnership for prosperity" in the Balkans. Then, in a rapid U-turn, he gave the order to attack.

With these attacks, it seems to me, the West has washed its hands of the people -- Albanians, Serbs and others -- living in the region. Thus the sins of the Government have been visited on the people.

NATO's bombs have blasted the germinating seeds of democracy out of the soil of Kosovo, Serbia and Montenegro and insured that they will not sprout again for a very long time. The pro-democratic forces in the Bosnian Serb republic have been placed in jeopardy, and with them the Dayton peace accords. NATO's intervention has also set the stage for a local war against Montenegro's pro-democracy President, Milo Djukanovic.

President Clinton should call off this attack now, and then begin negotiations aimed at securing the right to a peaceful life and democracy for all the people in Yugoslavia, regardless of their ethnic background.

Veran Matic is editor in chief of the independent station Radio B-92.

Name: Stephen Larrabee - Washington Analyst

email:

Message: ``The fact of the matter is air power can't do the types of things that need to be done in Kosovo...We should have had a backup plan and been ready for a stream of refugees,'' said Stephen Larrabee, a Washington analyst with the RAND Corp. think-tank.

He told Reuters he believed the United States and its European allies began their mistakes back in 1991 by not using force to dislodge Serbs from Vukovar, an important town in Croatia. That battle helped spark nearly a decade of Balkanwars. MORE. . .

Name: Veran Matic

email: Editor in chief of the independent station Radio B-92.

Message: Only weeks before the air strikes began, NATO's Secretary General, Javier Solana, suggested establishing a "partnership for prosperity" in the Balkans. Then, in a rapid U-turn, he gave the order to attack.

With these attacks, it seems to me, the West has washed its hands of the people -- Albanians, Serbs and others -- living in the region. Thus the sins of the Government have been visited on the people.

NATO's bombs have blasted the germinating seeds of democracy out of the soil of Kosovo, Serbia and Montenegro and insured that they will not sprout again for a very long time. The pro-democratic forces in the Bosnian Serb republic have been placed in jeopardy, and with them the Dayton peace accords. NATO's intervention has also set the stage for a local war against Montenegro's pro-democracy President, Milo Djukanovic. MORE...

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Message: U.S. Aircraft Carrier, F-117s Joining Kosovo Force 04:24 p.m Apr 03, 1999 Eastern
By Charles Aldinger

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The United States Saturday ordered the aircraft carrier Theodore Roosevelt and its attack jets into the Adriatic from the Mediterranean to join in NATO bombing and missile strikes against Yugoslavia.

Pentagon spokesman Ken Bacon said Defense Secretary William Cohen approved the shift as the Roosevelt steamed eastward in the Mediterranean with more than 50 strike jets toward a previously planned replacement of the carrier Independence in the Gulf near Iraq.

The carrier, also accompanied by four warships armed with Tomahawk cruise missiles, would arrive in the Adriatic Monday, Bacon told reporters. The United States already has six Tomahawk-armed ships hammering Serbian targets from nearby. MORE...

Name: Editors

email: The Balkan War in Easter

Message:

It looks like Milosevic won the first round.... It also looks like Milosevic will achieve his objective in clearing all the ethnic Albanians out of Kosovo in just ten days, thanks to NATO's high-tech air support! The ethnic Albanians are much worse off now, because of our "help" than they were before. Oh, what a comforting thought!

And the worst is yet to come. If NATO does not rescue the refugees in time NATO will share the responsibility for the genocidal catastrophe with Milosevic. "Partners in genocide" -- just what we needed. Oh what a lovely war!

"We had to bomb the village to save the village." Where did we hear this before?

Name: Paul

email:

Message: One thing we can all agree on is we can not get enough information. Here is a list of Media links that I have found usefull. Please add some more.....
International Press Links Page:
http://users.skynet.be/alexkarl/press.htm
France Press Online:
http://www.afp.com/
United Press International:
http://www.upi.com/
Associated Press:
http://www.ap.org/
Washington Post
htt://www.washingtonpost.com
New York Times
http://www.nytimes.com
CNN
www.cnn.com
Amnesty International: http://www.amnesty.org.uk/ BBC: http://news.bbc.co.uk/ PBS, Kosovo News with links to Regional news orgs: http://www.pbs.org/newshour/bb/europe/jan-june99/kosovo_index.html

Name: G. Marrero

email: GMar 1492

Message: Instead of running for the senate or congress, why not run for vice-president or even president.

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Message: Pope Urges Milosevic To Open Humanitarian Corridor   06:48 a.m. Apr 04, 1999 Eastern 

     VATICAN CITY (Reuters) - Pope John Paul Sunday appealed directly to Yugoslavia to open a humanitarian corridor to help Kosovo refugees.   In his Easter Sunday message, the Pope also denounced the ''ravaging fire of bombs'' as part of a ``diabolic spiral of revenge.'' 

  ``On this holy day, I feel duty-bound to make a heartfelt appeal to the authorities of the Federal Republic of Yugoslavia to allow a humanitarian corridor to be opened, in order for help to be brought to the mass of people gathered at the border of Kosovo,'' he said.   MORE...

Name: Gen. Colin Powell

email:

Message: "The challenge of just using air power is that you leave it in the hands of your adversary to decide when he's been punished enough," Powell told reporters before a speech in Blacksburg, Va. "So the initiative will remain with President Milosevic."  

Name: Father Sava

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Message: "The ironic statements that the goal of this operation is to prevent suffering of civilians are absolutely hypocritical and tragic. President Clinton speaks sweet words to the Serbian people while the bombers mercilessly destroy schools, kindergartens and fill the hearts of children with hatred against the peoples which they believed were their friends and supporters of true peace and democracy."

Name: Lawrence S. Eagleburger

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Message: "The real question is, Can NATO and the United States afford to fail? Now that we've gone this far, probably not. If anything stands in the way of an unstable 21st century it is [the NATO] alliance. Our credibility must be preserved or all the would-be Milosevics around the world will believe that they, too, can kill and maim with impunity."  

Lawrence S. Eagleburger was Secretary of State from 1992-93 and Ambassador to Yugoslavia from 1977-81. MORE...   

Name: Senator John McCain, R-Ariz

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Message: WASHINGTON -- Sen. John McCain spent more than five years as a prisoner of war in Vietnam and learned, he says, the dangers of limited measures. He is now a forceful advocate of all-out intervention in the Balkans. 

     Almost ubiquitous on television news shows, McCain, R-Ariz., steadily makes the case from which President Clinton shies away -- that America can no longer afford to rule out the use of ground troops in Kosovo. He maintains that the United States, having begun the air campaign, must preserve its credibility by beating back the Yugoslav president, Slobodan Milosevic.  MORE...

Name: Mitch McConnell, R-Ky

email: Arm the Kosovo Liberation Army?

Message: WASHINGTON -- With the NATO bombing campaign in Yugoslavia so far unable to deter the atrocities in Kosovo, and the United States unwilling to commit ground troops, the idea of arming the Kosovo guerrillas has garnered support from a number of politicians and former policy-makers.  

   The Kosovo Liberation Army offers "a credible, capable and willing alternative to the deployment of Americans," Sen. Mitch McConnell, R-Ky., wrote to Secretary of State Madeleine Albright on Thursday.

   McConnell and Sen. Joseph Lieberman, D-Conn., have proposed spending $25 million to arm the Kosovo rebels. Sen. John Kerry, D-Mass., was among the first to raise the idea of arming the Kosovo guerrillas, and Zbigniew Brzezinski, who was national security adviser to President Jimmy Carter, has expressed support for such a plan.  

But the Clinton administration and its NATO partners are resolutely against the idea. They view Kosovo's Albanian rebels with considerable wariness, if not alarm, because of their political ideologies and questionable commitment to democracy. Some in the rebel movement are considered hard-line Marxists, others Islamic fundamentalists.  MORE....

Name: Senator Bob Dole

email: Use all necessary means to win the war

Message:   Dole calls on the Clinton administration to ``use all     necessary means'' to achieve all of its objectives in the area.     If we fail and allow Serbian aggression in Kosovo to     stand, this month's celebration of the 50th anniversary of NATO     conceivably could become NATO's funeral.''  MORE....

Name: lorelei kraft

email: loreleikraft@hotmail.com

Message: News reports state that the U.S. will accept 20,000 Kosovo refugees. I don't know what the plans are for housing them, but I am willing to take one or two refugee families. Please let me know if I can be of service. I also feel we must stay in Kosovo till the massacres stop.

Name: Wee-Willey-Jeff

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Message: "We had to bomb the village to save the village."

Actually, I think it was "We had to destroy the military to save it." was a statement the press falsely attributed to an American Officer in Viet-Nam.

Hillary said "It takes a village to do somethingorother"

I said "It takes an intern to destroy my legacy"

Oh, yes, I too am willing to take in a few poor, helpless Albanians. Send me three or four teenage girls. Make sure they got "C" cups or better and cain't speak a lick of English.

Name: Wee-Willey-Jeff

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Message: In response to worldwide cries for justice

I am

OUTTING SLOBODAN MILOSEVIC

Yes, the DNC has dispositive proof that the Serbian Butcher is, in fact, a homosexual and frequents gay bars on the east side of Belgrade and currently lives with his gay lover of ten years, Vladamir Goborbowski.

Name: Graduated High School

email: But WWJ?

Message: But WWJ, does this mean that you are an intolerant, hate-mongering homophobe for dropping bombs on Slobodan Milosevic? SF liberals may be confused by this.

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Message: Stop the war - SEND HILLARY!

She can turn a grand into a houndred thou in the futures market
She can stop the ethnic cleansing

SEND HILLARY
SEND HILLARY
Stuck a rifle in her paws and she's Kickin' ASS and takin' names. Go HILLARY go!!!

Name: Wee-Willey-Jeff

email: to Mr. High School

Message: I am anything but intolerant towards the gays and thesbians. I have said over and over that much of my political fortune was made by breaking promises to the homosexual community.

I have simply responded to the world-wide cry to "out" Slobodon Milosevic. Or was that "oust"? Oh, well, who cares. It's not important whether I actually did anything, just that I care.

Name: Wee-Willey-Jeff

email:

Message: Dang! Talk about a serious "HUMAN CATASTROPHE" The Playboy channel just went out.

Dang!

Name: SLOBODAN MILOSEVIC

email: Low-tech Headquarters in Belgrade

Message: Ha, ha, ha, ha you American pigs... You may think you have all the time in the world to shoot at my forces like fish in barrel... but you do NOT, ha, ha, ha, ha... because I am saddling you with Kosovo refugees faster than you are degrading my army.. Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha....

As long as you rely on air power alone... fools that you are...you are speeding up my objective to rid Kosovo of every single miserable Kosovar, Ha, ha, ha, ha...Do you know how long it takes air power to destroy an entrenched army in the Balkans? No, I knew you didn't. Ha, ha, ha, ha....

My forces rely on low-tech terror than can force the Kosovars out of Kosovo, no matter what the weather, and much faster than you can cripple me. You wanted the Kosovars, well now you can have ALL 1.8 million of them. Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha.....

You can bomb me all the way back to the stone age but I've got Kosovo and you've got the Kosovars. Ha, ha, ha, ha ... that's very funny don't you think?

Name: Graduated High School

email: to: Wee-Willey-Jeff

Message: Slobodan Milosevic is mocking you and your military "strategy." It looks like you are playing into his hands and hastening the removal of "ethnic Albanians" with your bombing. He is laughing at you, mocking your "manlihood," and your "Rhodes Scholar" intellect. What are you going to do about it?

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Message: The Mad Hatter of Pennsylvania Avenue

Capitol Hill Blue
4-5-99 Doug Thompson

The Rant

I am, therefore I rant. . .

The Mad Hatter of Pennsylvania Avenue

The Kosovo war, we are constantly reminded, is a campaign to stop the actions of a madman.

This may well be true, but it may be time to face the unpleasant fact that the madman is not in Yugoslavia, but back here at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue.

Yep. The real madman in this headlong march towards global war may just be William Jefferson Clinton.

Reports out of the White House and Pentagon say Clinton has become so obsessed with his "legacy" that he is willing to kill American soldiers to try and redefine his place in the history books.

Clinton doesn't want to be remembered as the President who got blow jobs from interns while conducting the nation's business. Nah, he wants to go down in history (pun fully intended) as the madman who sent young men and women to die in a desperate attempt to reshape his presidency.

Madness? You bet it is. Insanity? How much more proof do we need?

Clinton's mental stability (or the lack of it) has been the subject of whispers around Washington for some time now.

Would a sane man have risked his presidency for quickies in the Oval Office? Good question.

Would a sane man rape an Arkansas businesswoman in a Little Rock hotel room 21 years ago, leaving her bruised and bleeding on the bed, then put on his sunglasses and calmly tell her that she'd "better put some ice on that?" Better question.

"There are sufficient outward signs that the President's mental stability could be subject to question," says psychologist Dr. Stephanie Crossfield, who has been watching Clinton (at our request) for some time now.

This is the good doctor's professional way of saying the President may be loony tunes. Nuts. Wacko.

Problem is, this nutcase has the power to send our troops into war. This fruitcake can deploy nuclear weapons. This madman can destroy life as we know it on this planet.

And there ain't a lot we can do about it. Clinton has survived enough political scandals to sink a dozen other politicians. Each time he survives, his arrogance grows, along with the inability of anyone to do anything about his illegal, immoral and treasonous actions.

An American public that doesn't want to dump a President over sex also doesn't want to think they were duped into twice electing a madman to office. If they wouldn't buy his crimes (despite overwhelming evidence), how are they going to accept insanity (which is harder to prove)?

Impeachment? Been there, failed that. Under the Constitution, a majority of the cabinet could declare the President incapacitated and relieve him of his duties, but Clinton's cabinet doesn't have the balls to do that. The military, clearly frustrated with serving under a draft dodger, could take over the government, but this country fears military rule even more than it does a madman.

Which leaves the uneasy prospect of trying to survive 21 more months with the Mad Hatter in charge. That prospect scares us a hell of lot more than any Serbian strongman in Yugoslavia.

--Doug Thompson

Founder, Publisher & Editor

Capitol Hill Blue

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Message: Devastating blow to Susan McDougal's defense - Rebuttal witness has render her defense null and void (Susan better get used to prison food and orange jumpsuits!)

Starr prosecutor says his hope had been to clear the president

AP

Starr prosecutor says his hope had been to clear the president
12.05 p.m. ET (1606 GMT) April 5, 1999

By Peggy Harris, Associated Press

LITTLE ROCK, Ark. (AP) — Defending the work of Kenneth Starr's office, a former Whitewater prosecutor testified today at Susan McDougal's trial that he had hoped to exonerate President Clinton for the good of the country.

Recounting a 1995 conversation, prosecutor Ray Jahn said he told Starr on going to work for the independent counsel "that it was my hope that we would be able to clear the president.''

According to Jahn, he told Starr it wouldn't be good for the country to have the kind of disruption a criminal investigation of the president would bring.

Jahn — who won convictions against Mrs. McDougal; her ex-husband, James; and then-Gov. Jim Guy Tucker in a 1996 Whitewater trial — said he votes Democratic and works for a Clinton-appointed U.S. attorney in San Antonio.

A career prosecutor, Jahn has come in for strong criticism during Mrs. McDougal's four-week trial.

Taking the witness stand in her own defense, Mrs. McDougal portrayed Jahn as a vindictive prosecutor pressuring her to give perjured testimony that falsely implicated the Clintons in wrongdoing.

Mrs. McDougal's criminal contempt and obstruction trial is drawing to a close, with Jahn being one of the prosecutors' few rebuttal witnesses before final arguments later this week.

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Name: LVD

email:

Message:

Why was Maxine Waters the only person in Congress who opposed this war? Where were you? Why didn't you speak up as eloquently as you now have done so many days after the fact????

Maxine thought she was voting on a resolution in support of the band "War" - she is not a big fan of the song "We can't we be friends". I guess the editor did not read the article - the point was simple: the vote in the Congress was completely meaningless because the "war" was already underway and the vote was relegated to a bill of support for the troops ALREADY involved in a war - their only other recourse was to defund the military action which would simply cut off the money while leaving them in the field (which nobody wanted to do - except Maxine Waters, no big surprise there!) (BTW - Maxine Waters is a pig if it is true that she voted to defund the troops already in the field). If Clinton would have FOLLOWED the constitution and asked congress BEFORE turning control of our military over to a Marxist (the leader of NATO) - things would be different.

Isn't it fun to watch the editor scramble for the high ground. Sorry, if not for the actions of people like you cats, we would not be in this situation. The Editor vacated the high ground with their blind support for Clinton and no amount of fancy footwork will change that.

-LVD

Name: Graduated High School

email:

Message: I think the point that Ms. Chenoweth is trying to make is that this "NATO action," "containment," (it's the era of Clinton - pick a euphamism [has "war" been used by our esteemed [gag, cough] leader yet?]) was pulled off by completely bypassing Congress. And now congress can only vote to spend the money to support the troops. Old Bubba has given (by default and incompetence/lack of PRINCIPLE) command of our armed forces to a Spanish Marxist — NATO Secretary-General Javier Solana. Accepting bribes by Chineese Communists, letting a foreigner send our people to war, that will be Clinton's "legacy."

Name: Editor to LVD

email:

Message: And again we ask you LVD.... Why didn't YOU oppose the war? Where were you when Zippy and I opposed the war? Why were you so quiet when you are usually so loud? We not only opposed the war, we also took steps to apprise you of world wide articles regarding the war, not just the American press. We turned you on to the Kosovo Daily News right at the start before the full impact of the war became clear to most Americans, it was clear on this forum. We did that. Give credit where credit is due, LVD. We bring you all points of view on this forum. We try very hard to get to the truth.

Please remember, LVD, the war is not over yet.... It looks very bad for NATO, but NATO's future rides on the outcome of this war, and unfortunately so does America's -- (that's you and me.) NATO knows it cannot go down in defeat against a tiny country with a little Hitler called Milosevic. I'm hoping NATO will pull something off, and you should too. At least NATO is taking care of the refugees and that is an enormous relief.

Name: Last Visible Dog (with a clear conscience) to the (guilt ridden) Editor

email:

Message:

The Editors on the Hillary Clinton Forum and Zippy the Wonder Slug were the only ones on this forum who openly stated their opposition to the war BEFORE the war started.

Jeepers - somebody has a big ego (And I don't think Zippy wrote this message). I believe the Serbs most likely beat you out in the race to be openly opposed to the war before it started.

Don't point your finger at us and tell us we have blood on our hands. We openly stated that we did not support Clinton in this war. BUT... we DID NOT see your opposition written anywhere. Why didn't YOU speak up. You speak up about everything else. Why were you silent. Our hands are clean, LVD, how about yours? Jeepers Editor - you are dancing as fast as you can! First, I am also opposed to attacking Australia - are you saying if I haven't written a message claiming that I do not support the US of A attacking Australia then somehow I am supporting an attack on Australia. Jeepers - in you effort to flee from your support of Clinton you have also fled from making sense. (the following is a list of all the countries that Last Visible Dog does not support being attacked by the USA: Luxembourg, Antarctica, Iceland, France (well on second thought, maybe France), Belgium, oh heck - I am currently not is support of the USA attacking ANY sovereign nation!

Second, I have said that Clinton has proven himself to be unfit for office - Clinton proved he is VERY irresponsible. The Editor blindly supported Clinton. I said Clinton would likely do something irresponsible again if we allow him to stay in office. The Editor blindly supported Clinton. I said the next blunder Clinton does may be much worse than blowjobs with a subordinate employee half his age during business hours. The Editor blindly supported Clinton. I said JEEPERS! Clinton himself said (in writing) "he loathed the military". The Editor blindly supported Clinton. Now Clinton has bumbled his way into a fiasco that has so far caused the worst refugee problem since WWII and may: start WWIII (or at best restart the Cold War), kill many innocent people, and demoralize our military and leave us vulnerable. NOW, the editor is desperately turning their back and support from Clinton is an effort to reach high ground. SORRY - you reap what you sow. You wanted Clinton and people like you helped the Senate to follow polls instead of the law - now you has the Clinton War Fiasco, brought to you by the Clinton apologists. Your fancy footwork will not separtate you from your words of the past (just check out the past forums). If we would have followed the law - Clinton would be gone now and even I believe Gore has more sense then to start a war that we can not win.

Don't blame me if you are currently pulling a Lady MacBeth with trying to wash the Kosovo blood off your hands.

Editors, that dog continues to be unable to hunt (so to speak)

-LVD

Name: Graduated High School

email:

Message: Remember Hillary fans, we are all one big happy "village" and this little thing in Kosovo is just a little "village discipline." There, aren't we all feeling better now, after all there aren't any of those war-mongering, right wingers in charge of our military today.

Name: Last Visible Dog to That Dance'n fool, the Editor

email:

Message:

It looks very bad for NATO, but NATO's future rides on the outcome of this war, and unfortunately so does America's

Jeepers - Editor we do not agree on much. First, the future of the United States of America is NOT AT ALL tied to NATO. I have personally believed that ever since Reagan and Bush ended the cold war NATO no longer had a purpose. NATO was a defensive organization to fight the evil empire. Without an evil empire to defend against NATO has no purpose. Without a purpose, in my opinion, an organization like NATO can only do things to justify its existence (to START wars). I was correct. Did I make my feeling on NATO known to the forum? Well, I never stated on this forum that I secretly have a crush on Tori Amos - but that does not mean it is not true. There are a lot of things I have not presented to the forum.

NATO can and should die - there is currently no need for it. The fate of the US of A is not at all tied to NATO. The US needs to pull out as fast as we can - Clinton needs to accept his failure and we need to move on. If we want to arm one side of the Civil War - Ok. Did you realize we are currently supporting a group that sided with the German Nazi and who would turn downed US pilots over the Nazis? Clinton made a huge mistake. NATO has committed suicide (the day they became an aggressor organization). The future of OUR country is in the hands of an incompetent fool who will likely stop at nothing to desperately save his legacy. Why are we here - because of Clinton apologists. Editors - your fancy footwork is noteworthy but you months of rhetoric have securely glued you to the president. "You ask for it - you got it!"

We not only opposed the war, we also took steps to apprise you of world wide articles regarding the war, not just the American press. We turned you on to the Kosovo Daily News right at the start before the full impact of the war became clear to most Americans, it was clear on this forum. We did that. Give credit where credit is due, LVD. We bring you all points of view on this forum. We try very hard to get to the truth.

The difference between liberals and conservatives - Liberal seem to always claim that they speak for a group and are always using the word "we" (I guess they feel that their position is so shaky that they need to bolster it with imaginary support). Conservatives speak for themselves.

Editor - I never said you did not work hard to get the truth. My point is: Clinton is incompetent and this war is his fault (nearly every career military person was against it). Thinking Americans feared what Clinton might do next - Clinton apologist just made excuses for him. Clinton would not be president if not for the blind support of the Clinton apologists - THEREFORE, the Clinton Kosovo War fiasco rests partly on the hands of the Clinton apologists.

NATO knows it cannot go down in defeat against a tiny country with a little Hitler called Milosevic.

I tire of this White House spin - Milosevic is no Hitler (not even close).

. I'm hoping NATO will pull something off, and you should too

Unbelievable! That is the kind of BS statement the kept us in Vietnam for 12 years. How many American soldiers died and will die for this kind of logic. You are saying that NATO made a mistake and we must keep fighting and escalating until we find some way to claim victory (or like in Vietnam, we will just sneak out the backdoor after sacrificing nearly 70,000 Americans). Jeepers Editor you have patted yourself on the back for being a anti-war type and you actually once claimed that people like you ended the Vietnam war - why the complete reversal? (or in the words of Maxine Waters "[the Editor] has made a 360 degree turn") This is a mistake - END IT NOW! I don't believe we need to kill any more people, create anymore refugees, or offer any more of our own people up to be killed.

At least NATO is taking care of the refugees and that is an enormous relief.

The Clinton refugees - the people that are fleeing the bombing from USA. Clinton and NATO created these refugees!

The Chickens are coming home to roost (oh now, I have running out of barnyard analogies)

-LVD

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Message:

Is this you, WWJ?

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Message: Paper Compares Clinton to Hitler

Monday, April 5, 1999; 12:30 p.m. EDT

BEIJING (AP) -- Signaling its opposition to NATO airstrikes, a Chinese newspaper doctored a picture of President Clinton to make him look like Adolf Hitler.

The Yangcheng Evening News, a popular newspaper published in southern China, printed the photo of Clinton with a small black mustache and a protruding jaw on the front page of its most recent weekly news edition.

In it, Clinton looked down on a satellite photo of Europe as flames engulfed the northern part of the continent. ``The specter above Kosovo,'' the headline read.

Chinese leaders have condemned the NATO bombing of Yugoslavia as a violation of the U.N. charter and interference in sovereign country's affairs. And China's state-run media have been unrestrained in their criticism, with newspapers accusing the United States of bullying Yugoslavia.

Inside its weekly edition, published last Thursday, the Yangcheng Evening News carried three pages of stories about the crisis, including a sympathetic profile of Yugoslav President Slobodan Milosevic that called him a ``people's hero.''

The newspaper kept up the barrage Sunday with a signed commentary that accused NATO of trampling on international law. It said the capture by Yugoslav forces of three U.S. servicemen ``showed once again the hypocrisy of America's human rights outlook.''

They ``are so concerned about their compatriots' fate, but they don't show the least bit of pity for the Yugoslav people that they bomb,'' the newspaper said.

Copyright 1999 The Associated Press

Name: Last Visible Dog

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The newspaper kept up the barrage Sunday with a signed commentary that accused NATO of trampling on international law. It said the capture by Yugoslav forces of three U.S. servicemen ``showed once again the hypocrisy of America's human rights outlook.''

They ``are so concerned about their compatriots' fate, but they don't show the least bit of pity for the Yugoslav people that they bomb,'' the newspaper said.

Funny - this same thought crossed my mind last week.

-LVD

Name: Last Visible Dog

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The newspaper kept up the barrage Sunday with a signed commentary that accused NATO of trampling on international law. It said the capture by Yugoslav forces of three U.S. servicemen ``showed once again the hypocrisy of America's human rights outlook.''

They ``are so concerned about their compatriots' fate, but they don't show the least bit of pity for the Yugoslav people that they bomb,'' the newspaper said.

Funny - this same thought crossed my mind last week.

Name: LVD

email:

Message: This Forum hacker dweeb is getting on my nerves.

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Message: Kosovo: Obliterating American prestige (column)

The Free Lance-Star (Fredericksburg, Va.)
4-4-99 Jim Lakely

WALL-TO-WALL television coverage of Operation Allied Force makes everyone feel like an expert on military maneuvers and international diplomacy. Those former Army generals with the clean haircuts and civilian threads do a great job of breaking it all down.

But you don’t have to brush up on your military jargon to know what is going on. The look in their eyes says it all: This is one screwed-up operation.

It’s hard to imagine a more poorly planned military campaign. (By the way, we hold our fire on Iraq for the first day of Ramadan, but the bombing of Serbia continues during Holy Week? Happy Easter, everybody.)

President Clinton’s military advisers warned for weeks prior to the start of NATO airstrikes that a bombing campaign not backed up by ground troops would likely accelerate Slobodan Milosevic’s campaign of ethnic cleansing—the exact opposite result that Clinton intended.

But not only did the Clinton administration press on with a campaign that his military experts told him was a loser, he made an even more foolish blunder. Rather than beginning the operation by defining what we were willing to do to achieve our goals, he and his subordinates spent days reiterating what they would not do: involve ground troops in the war. Why? According to a published report in The Washington Post, “Clinton aides [said that] the administration would have been defying public opinion both here and in other NATO countries, and [been] criticized for risking a military quagmire.”

In other words, the idea of ground troops didn’t poll well, therefore, it’s off the table. Doesn’t anyone at the White House realize that you lead a country into supporting a war effort, you don’t follow them?

Once Milosevic heard that, he knew then that he had already won. America hasn’t followed through with a major military action since World War II, and we had announced no intention of doing so in Yugoslavia. In 1941, our military objectives were clear—get rid of Hitler and Tojo and make the world safe for freedom again. And while Clinton tried to cast Milosevic as a new Hitler, it didn’t resonate.

If Milosevic is evil incarnate, why were we trying to negotiate a treaty that would keep him in power? And if it’s a moral imperative to stop the atrocities, why are we balking on the use of ground troops who could put them to an end?

These are yet more uncomfortable questions the Clintonites can’t answer from the diplomatic corner we have bungled ourselves into. Our credibility in foreign policy was already shaky before this mess, and now it is completely obliterated.

We told Milosevic that he had better shape up or we’d get really mad. What a laugh from a president who ordered a Navy warship to retreat because a band of Haitian thugs was waving machetes at the dock. Saddam Hussein pops his head up every six months or so to thumb his nose at America, and after we lob a few bombs in his direction, he chuckles all the way back to his palace—politically stronger than ever for standing up to the world’s only superpower and living to tell about it.

Milosevic has learned these lessons well. With all strategic power ceded to him, he has exploited the bombing campaign for his own purposes, stepping up his ethnic cleansing of Kosovo. Now he has captured three American soldiers and plans to try them for war crimes. Our response? Mere words. We are committed to taking no further action.

White House officials are complaining to reporters that all this second-guessing is unfair. They say Clinton is being held to an impossible standard that is constantly shifting. That might be true if there were any standards to shift. But it has been obvious from the first day that the operation was not going to work. Yet the administration’s only response is to continue bombing. There is no Plan B.

he Balkans have been in the crossfire of two world wars, the Crusades, and an era of oppression behind the Iron Curtain. The people of this troubled land still talk with hot blood about the marauding hordes of the Ottoman Turks six centuries ago. How can we possibly expect our bombs to change anything? If we were not willing to follow all the way through with this operation—and that includes using ground troops to remove Milosevic from power—we never should have started.

Instead, we are faced with two terrible choices largely of our own making: (1) Continue a counterproductive bombing campaign that has actually advanced Milosevic’s ultimate goal of expelling the ethnic Albanians, or (2) stop the bombing and have little leverage to help negotiate a settlement that will allow the Serbs and Kosovars to live in peace.

Either way, Milosevic—the Butcher of Belgrade—comes out the winner.

JAMES G. LAKELY is an editorial writer for The Free Lance–Star.

My Archives

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Message: Susan McDougal's defense is in a complete shambles and a guilty verdict now seems inevitable.

Starr prosecutor says he tried to allay Mrs. McDougal's fears

AP
4/5/99

LITTLE ROCK, Ark. (AP) - Trying to persuade Susan McDougal to talk, Kenneth Starr's office offered to let someone else decide whether she committed perjury, a former Starr prosecutor testified Monday.

Ray Jahn said Starr's prosecutors told her in recent years that if there where a question about whether Mrs. McDougal perjured herself, the matter would be turned over to an independent prosecutor.

The offer didn't do any good, Jahn testified in the fifth week of Mrs. McDougal's criminal contempt and obstruction trial.

Mrs. McDougal went to jail rather than cooperate with Starr's investigation, saying she was afraid she'd be charged with perjury unless she told Starr's office a story that implicated the president and first lady in wrongdoing.

Jahn, who formerly worked for Starr's office, gave a point-by-point rebuttal to Mrs. McDougal's sworn testimony that prosecutors tried to get her to tell lies about the Clintons.

Jahn denied:

-Ever saying he could make Mrs. McDougal's legal problems go away if she cooperated with Starr in the Clinton probe.

-Telling Jim McDougal that if his ex-wife would simply say she had a sexual affair with Clinton, she could ``write her own ticket'' with Starr's office.

On cross-examination, McDougal lawyer Mark Geragos tried to get Jahn to admit that Starr had a plan to convict Mrs. McDougal and ``roll her'' over to testify against the Clintons.

Jahn conceded there's always a possibility that ``today's defendant is tomorrow's witness'' but he said Starr's office simply wanted the ``total and complete truth.''

Jahn said he votes Democratic and now works for a Clinton-appointed U.S. attorney in San Antonio. Nevertheless, while on Starr's staff, he won convictions against Mrs. McDougal; her ex-husband, James; and then-Gov. Jim Guy Tucker in a 1996 Whitewater trial.

Jahn said he told Starr on going to work for the independent counsel ``that it was my hope that we would be able to clear the president.''

Jahn said he told Starr it wouldn't be good for the country to have the kind of disruption a criminal investigation of the president would bring.

Starr's office put Jahn on the witness stand as a rebuttal witness.

Name: Robert J. Paumer

email: lcosta@inreach.com

Message: Madeline Albright is a total distaster! Shit-can that bitch!

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Message: NATO "riding a tiger" in Yugoslavia, China says

By slavonac@primenet.com 5:35pm
Mon 5 Apr

BEIJING, April 5 (AFP) - NATO was "riding a tiger" in Yugoslavia and it would be even more difficult for it to get off, the Chinese     army's journal warned Monday, predicting that a deployment of ground troops was practically unavoidable. 

    "Everything points to the fact that it will be very difficult to avoid deploying ground forces because otherwise it will be     impossible to put an end to the war," the Liberation Army Daily commentary said. 

    NATO again Sunday ruled out sending ground troops into Kosovo without a viable peace agreement between Belgrade and Kosovo's     ethnic Albanian population.  

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Name: Russia

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Message: "War to the hilt between communism and capitalism is inevitable. Today, of course, we are not strong enough to attack. Our time will come in thirty or forty years. To win, we shall need the element of surprise. The Western world will need to be put to sleep. So we shall begin by launching the most spectacular peace movement on record. There shall be electrifying overtures and unheard of concessions. The capitalist countries, stupid and decadent, will rejoice to cooperate to their own destruction. They will leap at another chance to be friends. As soon as their guard is down, we shall smash them with our clenched fist." - Dmitrii Z. Manuilskii (Lenin School of Political Warfare, Moscow, 1931)

"Comrades, do not be concerned about all you hear about glasnost and perestroika and democracy in the coming years. These are primarily for outward consumption. There will be no significant internal change within the Soviet Union other than for cosmetic purposes. Our purpose is to disarm the Americans and let them fall asleep. We want to accomplish three things: One we want the Americans to withdraw conventional forces from Europe. Two, we want them to withdraw nuclear forces from Europe. Three we want the Americans to stop proceeding with Strategic Defense Initiative." - Mikhail Gorbachev Nov. 1987 address to the Soviet Politburo

"There is profound error and harm in the disoriented claims of bourgeois ideologues that there will be no victor in a thermonuclear war." - A.S. Milovidov, Russian Military Theorist

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Name: Editor

email: WIN THE WAR -- DECISIVELY

Message: The suffering of the refugees herded into trains and tossed into the open fields of Macedonia has left us no option but to fight this war to WIN -- DECISIVELY!

While we, the editors, opposed this war in the beginning, there is only one position we can take now and that is to demand that NATO makes a heroic effort to save the refugees, and to win the war decisively. We cannot fight this war in half measures. Whatever it takes we must do.

Name: Mr Deleted

email:

Message: Editor/ Censor.....My my you HAVE been very busy as well as vigilant. Your censorship of statements contrary to your demented beliefs have been exceptionally fast. Typical "Liberalism" at work.

One observation concerning your Censorship "Editor", which is a very appropriate term, is how overwhelming conservative discourse would be if allowed.

Your "Forum" is a typical liberal sham.

.

OK.....(smile)DELETE

Name: Last Visible Dog to Editor

email:

Message:

So now we need to invoke the Vietnam strategy in Kosovo

Clinton made a big mistake and completely misunderstood the situation. Clinton caused more problems then were there before we started killing people. Now we have peace-nik liberals like the Editor saying - Kill Milosevic, Kill the opposition - DIE, DIE, DIE. Why do liberal always hold inconsistent positions? Let me guess - the Editor would be against the war if the president had an "R" by his name. This is so phony - just like most of the phony Vietnam protestors (that have the blood of many American soldiers on their hands). The only thing we are doing in Kosovo right now is tying to save face for NATO and Bill "weasel boy" Clinton. How many more need to die for Bill Clinton's legacy? So now the Editor wants American soldiers to fight and die in an unwinable war yet the Editor claims to have been against the Vietnam War - this is amazing! (it is obvious the Editor is not a male of draft age nor does the editor have a family member that is in the military).

Editor - to understand the situation, put it in real terms. How many of YOUR family members and YOUR love ones are you willing to have killed to recreate a Clinton legacy?

Ponderous!

-LVD

BTW - You are extremely historically naïve if you think there is a way to win decisively in Kosovo. Let me guess - you want to bomb them back into the Stone Age (sound familiar). There will be no victories in Kosovo - they have been fighting for a thousand years and if it foolish to think Bill Clinton is going to whip out his "big gun" and decisively win the war. If Clinton follows the Editors strategy - America get ready for a very long meaningless and bloody (unconstitutional) war.

Name: Graduated High School

email: War? What war? Whoever said "war?"

Message: Has Bubba ACTUALLY DECLARED WAR yet? I'm not sure, sound like he is trying to play more word games - "persist until we prevail." Persist at what - what is the objective? Until we prevail at what - all Kosovo residents back in their homes and Milosevic and most of his army is dead? Looks to me like the war is already lost and was doomed when Bubba gave the enemy his strategy. Milosevic used NATO bombing to his advantage to move people out of the territory he was after. When Bubba's legacy and self-esteem is all important, everybody else PAYS for it.

Name: Majority of Americans

email:

Message: What are you all complaining about?

Stop your wining!

Get in line and follow the rest of the sheep!

68% Support Airstrikes.

55% Support Use of Ground Troops.

63% Approve of Clinton's Job Performance.

Bill Clinton Can Do No Wrong!

Name: Wee-Willey-Jeff

email:

Message: Ding, dang, Chinese! Ya' just cain't trust 'em! Justice Taney was right! They is just too freaking different. Ya' cain't trust them Chinese!

And anyone who has trouble with my procedural shortcuts on international law should wake up! I couldn't go to the U.N. and get a vote from the Security Council. If anyone fergot, the Ruskies got a seat there and they could veto any proclamation. Dang Ruskies -- cain't trust 'em.

So I ignored the Joint Chiefs as well. Lately they been leaking like bad plumbing run amok. I was hoping to blame some of my decisions on them. In fact, I was hoping to blame some decisions they opposed from day one. I was counting on their silence, but someone is leaking. Dang Joint Chiefs, ya' cain't trust 'em. Ultimately, this entire war is due to Juanita Brodderick and the rest of those bimbo trailer sluts. If They'd kept their big mouths shut.... dang, women, ya' cain't trust 'em

I like the lil' mustache, it works!

Name: Wee-Willey-Jeff

email:

Message: The suffering of the refugees herded into trains and tossed into the open fields of Macedonia has left us no option but to fight this war to WIN -- DECISIVELY!

Yaaaahhoooooo! Who'da thoght we could get the SF liberals to line up on the side of war? Especially one our Joint Chiefs wanted to avoid. Grab an M-16 everyone 'cause we got some Serb killin' to do! Yeeesssssss!!!

God bless CNN, the American press, and liberals everwhere. Watch them polls skyrocket! The only thing Americans love more than a sex and perjury scandal is a good war to help them forget about a few minor, boring felonies.

This is what I've waited for
This is it, boys, this is War

Name: Wee-Willey-Jeff

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Message: Legacy city, here I come!

Name: Wee-Willey-Jeff

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Message: Bring on the Albanian refugee babes 'cus I need a date!

Name: i love her

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Message: I did my time in the Navy as an enlisted man so I am not a military genius by far. But arent apache helicopters meant to provide support to advancing ground troops? You know, the apaches go in, kill some tanks and soldiers, making it safe for our guys to advance, they refuel and advance further, then do it again. Thats what they did in desert storm after 35 days of bombing. So, what are the apaches going to accomplish without ground troops to hold gained ground? It seems that all they are going to do is kill some tanks and soldiers, go back for gas, go back to the same spot and try to kill the new tanks and soldiers that moved into the same spot, and each time risk being shot down by the air defenses that the bombing hasn't worked on. In desert storm, the bombing campaign was used to keep the Iraqis busy till we got massive ground forces ready to invade. Why are we not at least getting ground forces ready IN CASE we are forced to invade? Also, many thanks to MSNBC, CNBC, ABC, and CNN for reporting what time, how many, and what kind of aircraft are taking off from italy so the Serbians know when to hide their stuff. Are we a country of idiots or what? We shouldn't be there at all but since we are now responsible for accelarating the death of thousands of kosovars, we need to get our st together and get it over with. There was this woman named Kikki that debates Ollie North on MSNBCs Equal Time that said that we had to start bombing right away because the serbs would have eventually started killing the Kosovars anyway. She made a very stupid comment that "Whats it matter if it is now or six months from now?". Well my dear kikke, I'm sure there are a lot of kosovars that would have appreciated living for an additional six months. Where is my Hillary?? I told you all that Hillary was the one that was really running our country. She goes off for a few days to ride some camels and look how Bill screws up. Hillary for president!

Name: i love her to editors

email: this is a first

Message: Why was Maxine Waters the only person in Congress who opposed this war? Where were you? Why didn't you speak up as eloquently as you now have done so many days after the fact???? --- It doesn't matter what any congressman or senator says or has said. Every president democrat and republican has ignored the War Powers Act and sent the miltary into combat without congrssional approval and a formal declaration of war. In Bills letter to congress, he asked for support but pointed out he did not need it. The only thing congress can do is to cut funding for the operation which would have made it more of a fiasco. I think trying to shift the blame of this to anybody in congress and the senate is kinda silly.

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Message: Maxine Waters thought they said opposed this whore, and she said YES.

Name: i love her

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Message: Go Susan! I say a news report with Susan McDougal walking while holding hands with Julie Hyatt-Steele. They also hugged a lot. What babes. I wish I could party with those two after this trials over!

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Message: Where's James Carville? I want him to to declare "This is wahr!"

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Message: Where's James Carville? I want him to to declare "This is wahr!"

Name: THE REAL COST OF KEN STARR'S INVESTIGATION

email: from the Drudge report

Message:

COST OF U.S. MILITARY OPERATION IN KOSOVO ESTIMATED TO TOP $3 BILLION

The cost of the U.S. air campaign against Yugoslavia already has topped the $400 million mark, according to a soon-to-be-published report, and the price tag quickly could balloon to between $2 billion and $4 billion if the airstrikes proceed for even a few weeks longer.

I also heard an unconfirmed report that 19 American soldiers' bodies were secretly shipped from the Balkans for their eventual return to the U.S.

Perhaps Ken Starr's $44 million investigation seemed expensive at the time, but obviously we are paying a bigger price by letting that cowardly, draft-dodging, felon stay in office. Maybe we wouldn't be having these little wars more designed to boost Clinton's ratings rather than solve problems. Pardon me, but even in Iraq, we applied economic pressures and we tried every other option before attacking Saddam's thugs. Zieg Heil, Herr Klinton!

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Message: For the price tag on Clinton's little "ratings war", Ken Starr could investigate the corrupt Clinton White House for the next 200 to 400 years. However, even that wouldn't assure America that Starr could uncover all the sleaze that Arkansas imported to D.C.

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Message: For the price tag on Clinton's little "ratings war", Ken Starr could investigate the corrupt Clinton White House for the next 200 to 400 years. However, even that wouldn't assure America that Starr could uncover all the sleaze that Arkansas imported to D.C.

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Message: On March 23rd, the order to commence hostilities was given to an American general by a Spanish Marxist — NATO Secretary-General Javier Solana. READ CAREFULLY, editors
"I have just directed the Supreme Allied Commander of Europe, General [Wesley] Clark, to initiate air operations in the Federal Republic of Yugoslavia," announced Solana, who insisted that the attack "is intended to support the political aims of the international community."

Congress played no role in defining those political aims, which means that the American people — in whose name Congress is empowered to act — were not permitted to play any role in the decision to commit our nation to war

What is being said is that control of US Armed forces has been handed to a person and a organization that is NOT the President and the US Congress. This is unconstitutional - plain and simple. To willingly surrender control of the US Armed forces is TREASON.

Name: Tony Snow

email:

Message: The following site is Tony Snow's commentary on this whole Balkans mess and is probably the most even keeled, insightful article I've seen on the subject.

PRESIDENT CLINTON HAS TAKEN A JUSTIFIABLE DRUBBING for the Yugo-slaughter, but he isn't the only one who deserves a trip to the woodshed.

Most congressional Republicans are guilty of appalling cynicism and silence. They figure Clinton has hugged the tar baby in the Balkans and they want to watch him writhe.

But the fun's over.

Now that the ‘honorables’ have returned

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Name: Editor to LVD

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Message: I DO have family in the armed forces. I have a Captain in Holloman Air Force Base who could be sent to Kosovo. Do I want to sacrifice him to save Albanians? NO, of course not.

But I do want to save the refugees NOW, and spend whatever it takes to do that. We are not doing enough to save them. As Americans, we must take the blame for this catastrophe because it was not a surprise that Milosevic was going to do it. It was his whole objective. I know Milosevic threw them out of the trains and on to the fields where he left them there, either to die or for us to save.

I don't care if we flatten everything in Kosovo. If we don't save the lives of those we inadvertently endangered then we are NOT fighting a humanitarian war. If this is supposed to be a humanitarian war then prove it!

Name: Editor to ???

email:

Message: "What is being said is that control of US Armed forces has been handed to a person and a organization that is NOT the President and the US Congress. This is unconstitutional - plain and simple. To willingly surrender control of the US Armed forces is TREASON. "

Yes, I know about this and you make a VERY GOOD POINT.

Name: Editor to Wee-Willey-Jeff

email:

Message: No, I don't love this war. It has put me into a depression. I think about the refugees when I am cuddled up in my warm bed. I think about them when I eat my delicious food. I think about them when I interact with my happy children and grandchildren. I think about them when I am cold and on my way to get a warm garment -- what if there was no warm garment -- how long could I hold out. It goes on and on and on.....

Bernie Ward, a popular talk show host on KGO is now broadcasting from Macedonia. He describes one group of refugees standing in mud. They cannot get out because the Macedonian army will not let them. They have been standing there for days with nothing but water.... Why can't our high-tech helicopters save them?

Name: Editors

email: War Plans

Message: We either fight to WIN, or we get out NOW! Regardless we must save the refugees. If we pull out now Milosevic will drive all of them out, and we must save all of them. That's the price we must pay for starting this war.

According to the $$$$ we have spent on this war so far, and what we are planning to spend, we could pull out now and give every ethnic Albanian in Kosovo a free vacation somewhere until we settle with Milosevic. If we never settle with him the Albanians may, over time, find so much peace and happiness in another country that they wouldn't care about coming back.

So lose the war and save the Albanians!

Name: Wee-Willey-Jeff

email: to those wonderful caring editors

Message: Hey, I know Bernie Ward! He's a wunderful guy and will dissemble on anything I do. I heard him equate Christians to NAZIs onetime based on the fact the German belt buckle is inscribed "Got mit us". Well, he threw in alot of historical data that wasn't exactly true, but what is truth in the long run compared to rhetorical advantage

Anyway, you got to learn how to compartmentalize all yer feelings as I do. Instead of thinking about Albanians, think about the great ratings booster my little military actions are. Better than sex...well...almost.

Anyway, stop being so selfish and think about someone besides you and your feelings for a second and, like, consider how much this war means to ME. Hey, you went into all this with your eyes wide open. After my little missile attacks after my Monica mea culpa and during the impeachment vote, you knew I had this little missile fetish that manifests itself whenever I need to divert public attention. Lots of people died in those situations but did anyone express any real outrage? N-O-P-E -- nope! The liberal press understands as well as you do that these deaths were necessary to boost my ratings. Hell, they even branded anyone who questioned my acts, even those who uncovered facts inconsistent with my statements...as traitors to AMERICA! I love liberals. Talk about a win-win situation. Again, God bless you for choosing power over principle.

Now let me confide in you something that will chill your spine. There will be war not just because I want it, but because the American press wants it. War is good for their business. If you never believe anything else 'ol Wee-Willey-Jeff tells you, believe this. The American press wants war. Watch who they're promoting. Senator John McCain and Bill Crystal get twice as much coverage as the rest of the GOP. The press has been light on facts and heavy on emotion -- lots of images of suffering. Let's just hope emotions don't get too heated up or the Ruskies and every predominently slavic nation involved on the side of the Serbs. Hell, that really could lead to World War III. But...doesn't the immediate ratings boost make it all worth it!

Name: ControlGirl

email:

Message: "68% Support Airstrikes.
55% Support Use of Ground Troops.
63% Approve of Clinton's Job Performance."

Dang!!! Again I'm in the minority!!!

Name: Night-Editor to W-W-J

email: On Power and Principle

Message: We instinctively know what power is. Principles are subjective. Power is something you must deal with, but principles can be traded for survival or for personal gain.

America is a pragmatic. Our god is a political system called democracy: in-consensus-we-trust=democracy. We operate within a system and apply principles wherever they comfortably fit. It's the "Liberal Way", as you say... My path on the Liberal Way is to go from error-to-error until I reach my target. There are better ways to reach ones target but I'm stuck on this level because it works.

> Name: Night-Editor to W-W-J

email: Eastern Principle VS Western Principle

Message: You make strong points. I find myself actually reading your messages on this Forum -- must be the Blue Moon!

"Let's just hope emotions don't get too heated up or the Ruskies and every predominently slavic nation involved on the side of the Serbs. Hell, that really could lead to World War III. "