Name:   ..
Message:
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OP-ED COLUMNIST

Jesus and Jihad

By NICHOLAS D. KRISTOF

Published: July 17, 2004

If the latest in the "Left Behind" series of evangelical thrillers is to be believed, Jesus will return to Earth, gather non-Christians to his left and toss them into everlasting fire:

"Jesus merely raised one hand a few inches and a yawning chasm opened in the earth, stretching far and wide enough to swallow all of them. They tumbled in, howling and screeching, but their wailing was soon quashed and all was silent when the earth closed itself again."

These are the best-selling novels for adults in the United States, and they have sold more than 60 million copies worldwide. The latest is "Glorious Appearing," which has Jesus returning to Earth to wipe all non-Christians from the planet. It's disconcerting to find ethnic cleansing celebrated as the height of piety.

If a Muslim were to write an Islamic version of "Glorious Appearing" and publish it in Saudi Arabia, jubilantly describing a massacre of millions of non-Muslims by God, we would have a fit. We have quite properly linked the fundamentalist religious tracts of Islam with the intolerance they nurture, and it's time to remove the motes from our own eyes.

In "Glorious Appearing," Jesus merely speaks and the bodies of the enemy are ripped open. Christians have to drive carefully to avoid "hitting splayed and filleted bodies of men and women and horses."

"The riders not thrown," the novel continues, "leaped from their horses and tried to control them with the reins, but even as they struggled, their own flesh dissolved, their eyes melted and their tongues disintegrated. . . . Seconds later the same plague afflicted the horses, their flesh and eyes and tongues melting away, leaving grotesque skeletons standing, before they, too, rattled to the pavement."

One might have thought that Jesus would be more of an animal lover.

These scenes also raise an eschatological problem: Could devout fundamentalists really enjoy paradise as their friends, relatives and neighbors were heaved into hell?

As my Times colleague David Kirkpatrick noted in an article, this portrayal of a bloody Second Coming reflects a shift in American portrayals of Jesus, from a gentle Mister Rogers figure to a martial messiah presiding over a sea of blood. Militant Christianity rises to confront Militant Islam.

This matters in the real world, in the same way that fundamentalist Islamic tracts in Saudi Arabia do. Each form of fundamentalism creates a stark moral division between decent, pious types like oneself — and infidels headed for hell.

No, I don't think the readers of "Glorious Appearing" will ram planes into buildings. But we did imprison thousands of Muslims here and abroad after 9/11, and ordinary Americans joined in the torture of prisoners at Abu Ghraib in part because of a lack of empathy for the prisoners. It's harder to feel empathy for such people if we regard them as infidels and expect Jesus to dissolve their tongues and eyes any day now.

I had reservations about writing this column because I don't want to mock anyone's religious beliefs, and millions of Americans think "Glorious Appearing" describes God's will. Yet ultimately I think it's a mistake to treat religion as a taboo, either in this country or in Saudi Arabia.

I often write about religion precisely because faith has a vast impact on society. Since I've praised the work that evangelicals do in the third world (Christian aid groups are being particularly helpful in Sudan, at a time when most of the world has done nothing about the genocide there), I also feel a responsibility to protest intolerance at home.

Should we really give intolerance a pass if it is rooted in religious faith?

Many American Christians once read the Bible to mean that African-Americans were cursed as descendants of Noah's son Ham, and were intended by God to be enslaved. In the 19th century, millions of Americans sincerely accepted this Biblical justification for slavery as God's word — but surely it would have been wrong to defer to such racist nonsense simply because speaking out could have been perceived as denigrating some people's religious faith.

People have the right to believe in a racist God, or a God who throws millions of nonevangelicals into hell. I don't think we should ban books that say that. But we should be embarrassed when our best-selling books gleefully celebrate religious intolerance and violence against infidels.

That's not what America stands for, and I doubt that it's what God stands for.  source

 


Name:   Barry
To:   NICHOLAS D. KRISTOF

Re:   It's your choice
In response to:
Good vs Evil

Truth vs Lies

Message:
If you want to follow the teachings of an illiterate baby raping murder, that is your business


Name:   Just a friendly Reminder
To:   everybody

Message:
It just isn't safe yet to vote for a democrat.


Name:   Lord of Flies
To:   Forum Re 's

Re:   Sunken Skulls
Message:

http://youliveyourlifeasifitsreal.blogspot.com/


Name:   Editor
To:   The Hunting of the President

Message:
I went to see the movie: "The Hunting of the President" last night. It is very important for every American to see this movie. While it is very damning against the Republican 10-year,$80 million persecution of the Clintons, all Americans must learn from this movie in order to prevent it ever happening against future politicians on both sides.

For 10 years Republicans kept Americans fixated on this modern-day witch-hunt and inquisition, while the world was suffering and the Taliban was prospering. Washington caught this vicious disease and almost all went insane. It's frightening to think that an educated elite got sucked into this insanity. Here are some of the reviews:

"Those squeamish about Michael Moore's methodology, however, should check out..."The Hunting of the President." Thomason's movie, with its revelations of how Susan McDougal was pressured to lie to incriminate Hillary Clinton, is substantively more damning than 'Fahrenheit 9/11.'"
--TINA BROWN, THE WASHINGTON POST

"Riveting and revealing, whatever views you have on the partisan issues involved."M
--DAVID STERRITT, THE CHRISTIAN SCIENCE MONITOR

"Whatever your politics, it is a very, very powerful look at eight recent years of our history that I think we need to remember and reflect on. Harry Thomason, wonderful job!"
--CATHERINE CRIER, COURT TV

"In stringing the evidence together in one place, it makes a powerful case.
--JACK MATTHEWS, NEW YORK DAILY NEWS

"incendiary... an alarming treatise on the political power of the media and personal interests"
-- ELIZABETH RICHARDSON and JOSEPH BEYER, SUNDANCE FILM FESTIVAL

"...an eye-opening and occasionally chilling look at the lengths to which some will go to destroy someone they perceive as a threat to their way of life... The message is clear, and powerfully told. Extra credit should be given for managing to get Susan McDougal to tell the story of her ordeal and imprisonment in her own terms."
--PETE VONDER HAAR, FILM THREAT

"Fahrenheit 9/11...must be viewed in the context of another new documentary, the superb The Hunting of the President, that documents —irrefutably— the lengths to which the right went to destroy Bill Clinton."
-- David Edelstein, Slate

"This probing documentary... astutely allowing participants to tell their own tales... creates an emotional connection with people whose names are familiar from nightly news reports but whose intimate stories are not."
-- CATHY ROSS, AUSTIN CHRONICLE

"...when you combine "Fahrenheit 9/11" with another, less polemical, more straightforwardly frightening must-see documentary that's out now called "The Hunting of the President," which delineates the GOP's shockingly savage, calculated, historic attempt to destroy Bill Clinton, you've got a portrait of a Republican Party that makes the frayed ragtag fundamentalist nutballs of the Taliban look like the participants at some sort of Tupperware party."
--MIKE MORFORD, SFGATE

"The Hunting of the President," a potent screen translation of Gene Lyons and Joe Conason's bestseller, methodically compiles evidence suggesting there was indeed (as Hillary famously put it) "a vast right-wing conspiracy" waged against the Clinton White House. No matter one's party affiliation, this documentary is worth seeing for its eye-opening look at how disreputable characters can impact government -- and how easily the mainstream media can be duped into covering scandal-smelling leads."
--DENNIS HARVEY, VARIETY.COM

"The big draw was "The Hunting of the President," a funny, frightening documentary about the 10-year campaign to discredit Bill and Hillary Clinton."
-- JANE SUMNER, THE DALLAS MORNING NEWS


Name:   Scroll Mouse
To:   NICHOLAS D. KRISTOF

In response to:
"...No, I don't think the readers of "Glorious Appearing" will ram planes into buildings. But we did imprison thousands of Muslims here and abroad after 9/11, and ordinary Americans joined in the torture of prisoners at Abu Ghraib in part because of a lack of empathy for the prisoners.

Message:
C’mon now Nicholas. Torture? I guess we now know from where you speak


Name:   Gruber
To:   The Adamantly Beguiled

Re:   Eat at Joe's
In response to:
"incendiary... an alarming treatise on the political power of the media and personal interests"

Message:
Irony at its very best!


Name:   Liberal
To:   MIKE MORFORD

Re:   The Hunting of the Presidents
In response to:
"...when you combine "Fahrenheit 9/11" with another, less polemical, more straightforwardly frightening must-see documentary that's out now called "The Hunting of the President," which delineates the GOP's shockingly savage, calculated, historic attempt to destroy Bill Clinton, you've got a portrait of a Republican Party that makes the frayed ragtag fundamentalist nutballs of the Taliban look like the participants at some sort of Tupperware party." --MIKE MORFORD, SFGATE

Message:
Thank you Mike. History will not be kind to the Republican persecution of the Clintons. We can't see it now because those Republicans that participated in this persecution are too emotionally attached to see what they did, but their children and grandchildren will not be attached. They will read the history books and see this movie. They will understand what their grandparents supported, and they will not be proud.


Name:   ET
To:   J. Hoagland Reiftwaggoner

In response to:
Poor Scotty! Your inverted condition is probably related to your mother's early attempts to make a good ragpicker of you. In her gin-soaked delerium, she simply could not, and did not, realize the effect that the endless potpourri of fabrics, with their facinating variety of textures and colours and aromas, were inevitably having on you as a mere lad of three years age. We mustn't rule out those odours, either. You had frequent, early contact with the unprocessed intimate garments of both sexes as you endlessly sorted and piled, ripped and shredded, folded and stacked. Opposite you at your ...

Message:
Get out of here you hateful sicko. We don't need your kind here.


Name:   Da Nuze
Re:   Ya Wanna Talk About President Hunting?
Message:
From the networks "miscall" 1 hour before the polls in Florida closed, to the urban legend about his low IQ.

Talking points on "gravitas" repeated ad nauseum in every newspaper and on all three major networks

"Bush Deserter" mentioned 4 times more often than Clinton's lack of Vietnam service.

Both Joe Wilson and Richard Clarke have been discredited by the 9-11 commission and their own books yet none of the major newspapers or networks have made corrections to their banner stories slamming the Bush administration

Have the news organizations done any in-depth investigation of candidate Kerry?

Why has every story about the economy improving segued into "but things are not so good for..."


Name:   Scroll Mouse
To:   forum

Re:   Changing the tone between Left and Right
Message:

News that explains our world
Dennis Prager (archive)

In an interview with The New York Times Magazine, William F. Buckley Jr., on the occasion of his taking leave from National Review, the magazine he founded 50 years ago, was asked a series of questions. Needless to say, given the politics of The New York Times and its interviewer, the questions were nearly all challenging. But nothing quite prepared a reader for this one:

"You seem indifferent to suffering. Have you ever suffered yourself?"

In one sentence, a New York Times interviewer summed up the liberal view of conservatives -- "indifferent to suffering." As I have long believed, in general, conservatives think liberals are fools and liberals think conservatives are evil.

"There are signs, too, even dramatic ones, that fissures are opening up inside the Sunni-driven insurgency" (New York Times).

You needed to read to nearly the end of the article to read the above. The world's news media are rooting against an American, meaning a George W. Bush, victory in Iraq. But there are reasons for optimism regarding America's effort to introduce freedom to the Arab world.

A major reason aside from the extraordinary work of the American military and its courageous commander in chief is Iyad Allawi, the prime minister of Iraq. As a rule, the world recognizes great people only after they have died, and Allawi may turn out to be another Arab dictator. But based on what he has thus far accomplished, on his anti-Saddam activities before that and on his extraordinary courage in the face of repeated attempts to murder him, Allawi may be one of the few great leaders in the world today. Even if you're an atheist, you should pray for him. The bad guys, and they are very bad guys, hate him more than they do President Bush.

The Connecticut branch of the ACLU, the Connecticut Civil Liberties Union (CCLU) "informed the Windsor Locks (CT) School District that it would face (legal) action if education officials chose to allow a presentation by clergy at Windsor Locks High School on homosexuality and related topics."

The high school had previously invited a gay activist organization, the Stonewall Speakers, to address students on homosexuality and same-sex marriage. In order to attempt to present an alternate view, the school then invited clergy to speak to the students.

Because "the clergy was supposed to offer a view based on religious scripture," Annette Lamoreaux, a legal director of the CCLU, "reported that the clergy presentation could violate the Establishment Clause of the United States Constitution and the Connecticut Gay Rights Law, which prohibits discrimination based upon sexual orientation. . . . She added that it would have violated the rights of gay and students to equal protection . . ."

Here is another "smoking gun" illustrating the secular and leftist brainwash American children receive throughout their school life. For no defensible educational reason -- especially given the poor general education that so many Americans receive -- a public school invited gay activists to address students on behalf of same-sex marriage. But clergy defending man-woman marriage are not allowed to be invited.

The story also illustrates what ought to be considered a truism: The threat to an open society almost always comes from the Left. The most effective myth of my lifetime has been that the threat to an open society comes from the Right. In light of the fact that nearly every totalitarian regime in the 20th century was of the Left, the effectiveness of this myth is all the more remarkable. Yet, this successful attempt by the ACLU in Connecticut to stifle freedom of speech is just one more example of the totalitarian temptation that lies at the root of leftist ideals.

Finally, if civil libertarians now demand the stifling of speech on behalf of man-woman marriage, imagine what will happen if same-sex marriage becomes legal.

Traditional Christians and Jews will increasingly be marginalized by the Left in the media, academia and in law -- and declared as immoral as racists.

And a nationwide Canadian poll found that more than 40 percent of Canada's young people consider America "evil." It is not possible to overstate the destructive effect that the leftist education establishment and the leftist news media have had on Western civilization. Combine this with a similar poll in Europe that found Europeans believe that the United States and Israel are the most dangerous countries in the world and you begin to understand the moral havoc wrought by schools and news media.


Name:   Ledford Cole
To:   Angy At The Wrong Persons

Re:   Absurd "Movie"
In response to:
. Message: Thank you Mike. History will not be kind to the Republican persecution of the Clintons. We can't see it now because those Republicans that participated in this persecution are too emotionally attached to see what they did, but their children and grandchildren will not be attached. They will read the history books and see this movie. They will understand what their grandparents supported, and they will not be proud.

Message:
Pure bullsh!t. Sensible people do not get their history from partisan hack chop-job movies! Now go watch "Farenheiht 9-11" again. It was made by a big fat hate-filled jerkoff just for gullible people like YOU.


Name:   leftie
To:   Da Nuze

In response to:
From the networks "miscall" 1 hour before the polls in Florida closed, to the urban legend about his low IQ. Talking points on "gravitas" repeated ad nauseum in every newspaper and on all three major networks "Bush Deserter" mentioned 4 times more often than Clinton's lack of Vietnam service. Both Joe Wilson and Richard Clarke have been discredited by the 9-11 commission and their own books yet none of the major newspapers or networks have made corrections to their banner stories slamming the Bush administration Have the news organizations done any in-depth investigation of cand ...

Message:
Oh stop complaining about mistreatment. You ain't seen nuttin yet! We coming to get you buddy. You guys on the right taught us all we know about how to screw the opposition and this time you will get yours.


Name:   Really?
In response to:
They will read the history books and see this movie. They will understand what their grandparents supported, and they will not be proud.

Message:
Did the movie debunk the Riady/Lippo/PLA connection? Did it debunk the Schwartz/DNC/PLA sweet deal? Did it explain the persecution of Dale? did it expLain Hillary's secret task force? Did it cover the FBI files? Or the missing billing records?

You get my point don't you? Politics is a rough game. Don't stand back like some innocent virgin and whine about persecution of your hero. Your hero gave them all the ammunition they needed.


Name:   Dale Evans
To:   Quagmire

In response to:
Oh stop complaining about mistreatment. You ain't seen nuttin yet! We coming to get you buddy. You guys on the right taught us all we know about how to screw the opposition and this time you will get yours. --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Message:
Blow it out your vent, Chickenfart. JANET RENO IS NO LONGER ATTORNEY-GENERAL!!


Name:   At the Movies
In response to:
Pure bullsh!t. Sensible people do not get their history from partisan hack chop-job movies! Now go watch "Farenheiht 9-11" again. It was made by a big fat hate-filled jerkoff just for gullible people like YOU.

Message:
We have a new film genre, the flockumentary where a film-maker markets a film to a herd of sheep-like cultists e.g Farenheit 9-11, facts don't matter they only confuse the herd.


Name:   History
To:   Ledford Cole

In response to:
Pure bullsh!t. Sensible people do not get their history from partisan hack chop-job movies! Now go watch "Farenheiht 9-11" again. It was made by a big fat hate-filled jerkoff just for gullible people like YOU.

Message:
The history books, Ledford Cole, not the movie, will be the source that teaches your grandchildren what the Republicans did to the Clintons. The movie is just the harbinger of what the future will reveal. An $80 million investigation lasting 10 years to bring down the Clintons and all you guys got was a blowjob with an intern and lying to cover up - nothing!!! Washington went insane for all those years for nothing, nothing, nothing. Face it Ledford Cole, the Rublicans fidded with blowjobs while Rome burned.

And despite your evil witchunt President Clinton was the first Democratic president since Franklin D. Roosevelt to win a second term. He could point to the lowest unemployment rate in modern times, the lowest inflation in 30 years, the highest home ownership in the country's history, dropping crime rates in many places, and reduced welfare rolls. He proposed the first balanced budget in decades and achieved a budget surplus.

Just imagine how much the world would be better off today if you left Clinton alone to do his job.


Name:   Da Nuze
To:   left eye

In response to:
Oh stop complaining about mistreatment. You ain't seen nuttin yet! We coming to get you buddy. You guys on the right taught us all we know about how to screw the opposition and this time you will get yours.

Message:
How about the truth for a change?


Name:   leftie
To:   Really?

In response to:
You get my point don't you? Politics is a rough game. Don't stand back like some innocent virgin and whine about persecution of your hero. Your hero gave them all the ammunition they needed.

Message:
Hahaha - Your hero gave us all the ammunition we need too. The door swings both ways, short-sighted one.

If Republicans believed in Karma they would not behave as they do.


Name:   Monika
To:   Beguiled

In response to:
Just imagine how much the world would be better off today if you left Clinton alone to do his job.

Message:
Together, we got the job done.


Name:   Reality
To:   Yourstory

In response to:
The history books, Ledford Cole, not the movie, will be the source that teaches your grandchildren what the Republicans did to the Clintons. The movie is just the harbinger of what the future will reveal. An $80 million investigation lasting 10 years to bring down the Clintons and all you guys got was a blowjob with an intern and lying to cover up - nothing!!! Washington went insane for all those years for nothing, nothing, nothing. Face it Ledford Cole, the Rublicans fidded with blowjobs while Rome burned.

Message:
Clinton's own book contradicts his testimony and the stories told ad infinitum to repair his legacy. 80 million? boy that number goes up every time you guys talk about about it. Clinton himself could've stopped the entire mess by A)Not signing the independent counsel statute B) keeping it in his pants C)not perjuring himself D)settling it quietly E) firing Ken Starr F)Not lying to the nation and wagging his finger at us.


Name:   Maureen Dowd
To:   Kerry flubbed again

Message:
Hillary did what she does best. She brought the leader of the party to heel. And in giving her a prime-time slot, but only to introduce her husband, Mr. Kerry did what he does worst: Try to have it both ways.


Name:   leftie
To:   Reality

In response to:
Clinton's own book contradicts his testimony and the stories told ad infinitum to repair his legacy. 80 million? boy that number goes up every time you guys talk about about it. Clinton himself could've stopped the entire mess by A)Not signing the independent counsel statute B) keeping it in his pants C)not perjuring himself D)settling it quietly E) firing Ken Starr F)Not lying to the nation and wagging his finger at us.

Message:
Wake up Reality. The persecution of the Clintons had gone on for several years before Bill wagged his finger.


Name:   Scooter down on all four
In response to:
Your condition is probably related to your mother's early attempts to make a good ragpicker of you, Scotty. In her gin-soaked delerium, she simply did not realize the effect the fabrics, with their facinating variety of textures and colours and aromas, were inevitably having on you, a mere lad of three years age. We mustn't rule out those odours, either. You had frequent, early contact with the unprocessed intimate garments of both sexes as you endlessly sorted and piled, ripped and shredded, folded and stacked. Opposite you sat Dear Mummy, watching approvingly as you exerted yourself, str ...

Message:
Funny little toff..............


Name:   Scotty
To:   finger hut fans

In response to:
Keep in mind that "bald headed Nazi" gets chicks

Message:
Alot of women like that look.


Name:   Scotty
To:   Toker

In response to:
And despite your evil witchunt President Clinton was the first Democratic president since Franklin D. Roosevelt to win a second

Message:
Put an honest to goodness fly-boy with combat props in as head of the Academy.


Name:   Tito
To:   minorities!

Re:   Boo hoo.
In response to:
the lowest inflation in 30 years, the highest home ownership in the country's history, dropping crime rates in many places, and reduced welfare rolls. He proposed the first balanced budget in decades and achieved a budget surplus.

Message:
Will we ever return to the days of the most qualified individual getting the yob?


Name:   ..
Message:
WHY DOES THE WORLD HATE ISRAEL?

WHY DOES THE WORLD HATE ISRAEL?
by Herbert I. London
Townhall
July 18, 2004

Israel is a tiny nation, roughly half the size of Lake Michigan. Its population is roughly half the size of the New York metropolitan area. Despite being a Jewish state, more than twenty percent of its residents are Arab and most Jews in Israel describe themselves as secular rather than religious.

Yet if one were to read world press accounts or daily condemnations from the United Nations or the recent decision of the ICJ criticizing the construction of the fence, you might conclude that Israel is a world power intent on destabilizing Middle East affairs.

Why, it might well be postulated, does the world resent this speck of land between the Jordan River and the Mediterranean?

Although my comments are speculative, I suspect they could be borne out empirically if historical accounts were fair and objective.

Israel is a thorn in the side of the Arab world because it is a remarkable technological phantasmagoria. Almost every Israeli is engaged in a software scheme. The Jews in this arid nation have made the deserts bloom; they have converted brain power into technical marvels and consequent wealth.

By contrast every nearby Arab nation is dysfunctional. Their governments are tyrannical; the people are poor and uneducated and local officials have been unwilling to convert oil revenue into social benefits.

Resentment is the natural result of this contrast. Afterall, Israel has all of the geographic disadvantages of its neighbors and it doesn't have any oil fields. Yet it prospers, while others falter.

Second, it should be hastily noted that Israel is a proxy for anti-American sentiment. The misguided belief that the U.S. is an imperial power eager to put its stamp on the Middle East is demonstrated by the aid and support given to Israel. Rarely, is it noted by U.S. detractors that American assistance to Egypt is equal to aid for Israel. Moreover, American involvement in Iraq was neither precipitated by Israel (Does the tail wag the dog?) nor has this engagement influenced Israel's relations with her neighbors in any new directions.

Third, the Palestinian question has awakened emotions on the European left and in many Arab states. Yet remarkably the critique of Israel is generally quite banal. Arafat, as putative Palestinian leader, was granted 97 percent of the West Bank and some control over holy sites in the negotiation at Wye Plantation. Yet he turned down these generous Israeli terms.

In fact, there aren't any terms that serve the ambitions of Arabs eager to destroy the state of Israel, unless, of course, national suicide is a reasonable negotiating point.

Fourth, the fence has the metaphorical power of the Berlin Wall. It is used for propaganda purposes to argue that Israel is intent on "taking Arab land" and isolating itself from Palestinians.

What should be noted is that the Berlin Wall was created to keep East Germans bound to the chains of communism, while the Israeli fence is designed to prevent suicide bombers from continuing wreaking bloodshed among Israelis.

Intifada II has resulted in at least a thousand dead Israeli citizens since 2000 and others maimed as well. It is encumbent on any leader of any nation to offer his people a modicum of security against those bent on bloodshed. If the fence reduces threats and increases security, Prime Minister Sharon should embrace it. His duty to protect his own people transcends any obligation imposed on him from multilateral organizations.

Fifth, the Palestinians have made their case to the international court of public opinion more effectively than the Israeli government. They have positioned themselves as underdogs against a mighty military force from tiny Israel. They have persuaded many of their supporters that the land Israel acquired after the ‘67 war is "occupied" rather than "disputed" territory. Hence, their sanguinic tactics are ignored by opinion markers normally opposed to terrorist activity.

Sixth, the Palestinians manage their news media. There isn't an opposition voice in the Palestinian territory and if an unpredictable comment is made, it is often squelched with force. Reporters Without Borders has reported numerous occasions where journalists were beaten when they challenged Hamas or Hezbollah positions in print.

Israel, as an open and free society, entertains every point of view, including anti Israel arguments. As a consequence, criticism of Israel is widespread and criticism of Palestinian activity muted.

Seventh, the United Nations is now systematically organized to criticize the United States and Israel. It is instructive that in a statement emanating from the Secretariat's office condemning the construction of the fence, not a word was mentioned about suicide bombers who precipitated the construction.

As I see there is very little that can be done at the moment to change international opinion. Israel has an obligation to its own people to remain resolute against usually unfair and hateful allegations. For the Middle East this is the Dark Ages. But if the Arab world wishes to enter the 21st century – a far from clear conclusion – it will have to adopt and perhaps emulate much of Israeli life. On that slim reed, hope shall continue to exist.

Herbert London is president of Hudson Institute and the John M. Olin Professor of Humanities at New York University. He is publisher of American Outlook magazine and author of the recently published book, Decade of Denial (Lexington Books) and is reachable through www.benadorassociates.com.   source

©2004 Herbert London


Name:   Reality
To:   left eye

In response to:
Clinton's own book contradicts his testimony and the stories told ad infinitum to repair his legacy. 80 million? boy that number goes up every time you guys talk about about it. Clinton himself could've stopped the entire mess by A)Not signing the independent counsel statute B) keeping it in his pants C)not perjuring himself D)settling it quietly E) firing Ken Starr F)Not lying to the nation and wagging his finger at us. Message: Wake up Reality. The persecution of the Clintons had gone on for several years before Bill wagged his finger.

Message:
once again it's "evul rightwingurz" fault when the DNC tries to foist upon the public a candidate that the media knew had a long history of adultery and shady financial dealings but chose to instead to target the incumbent President with bogus stories about a weak economy and prop up the big eared troll Ross Perot.


Name:   Yuk
Message:
Dirty commie's............


Name:   Jimmy
To:   Toads

Message:
4Hmm, where to start with this one… Let’s just work our way through it bit by bit. “Overflowing with testosterone to the point of ill health.” I didn’t know this point existed! And frankly, I’m nervous! Just thinking about all that stuff flowing through my veins that makes me strong, independent, assertive and mentally focused freaks me out! Who would want to be like that? Surely I am the embodiment of poor health.

Then we’ve got some blah blah blah. This in turn blah blah blah. This in turn blah blah blah. This in turn blah blah blah. Am I stuck in a ing turnstile? This is like listening to a woman give directions. Right. Another right. Another right. Another right. I am back at “Go”! Can you conjure up only one cause-and-effect related phrase?! For the sweet love of Christ! Your juvenile literary mannerisms are like Chinese water torture! You are either the stupidest broad to ever stroll the grassy knolls of that mossy turd of a country or you are an evil genius insidiously pecking away at my sanity with your repetitive mongoloid word choice and sentence structure!

And yes, “Willy nilly” is our current foreign policy. It is only mere coincidence that the handful of countries we have meddled with have been run by dictatorial regimes. Kosovo, Iraq, Somalia, Liberia: it was just happenstance that we rolled into those locations all “willy nilly” demanding freedom for their inhabitants. All I really can do is offer my sincere apologies to their citizens for trying to extend the benevolent hand of freedom and friendship to their abused populace. Our bad.

Am I going to resort to “name calling?” Hey, sweetheart, I call ‘em as I see ‘em. I’m not “resorting” to anything. See, in this country we can say what we like. I know it’s a strange concept, but we can name-call to our red-white-and-blue heart’s extent and no one is going to say —except for a few rats like you. As for you bumping donuts or eating tofu, hey, whatever blows your dirty hair back. And you feeling “securely insulated from [me] all these thousands of miles away,” well, good for you. I’m glad that in between dodging shrapnel from IRA pipe bombs and eating boiled potatoes you can glean some sort of feeling of security from my lack of immediate presence.

And to step back a paragraph in your email http://beam.to/bbs_4 to where you said, “Did [I] ever consider a girlfriend, it might go soem way to relieving [my ill health]”… No, sweetheart, I’m waiting for an intellectual savant like yourself to come stumbling into my life. Then I can look forward to long romantic days of teaching you how to use the ing spell check tool in your word processing program.


Name:   .
Re:   Be Vewwy Qwiet We're Hunting Pwesidents....
In response to:
Maureen Dowd

Message:
the lovely one got her chops by peddling a sham story about Nancy Reagan having an affair with Frank Sinatra.


Name:   Reality
To:   left eye

Message:
Why do the New York Times and the LA Times only run stories about the homeless during Republican presidencies?


Name:   Reality
To:   left eye

Message:
How does a former ENRON advisor (Paul Krugman)have any credibility?


Name:   Rightie
Message:
Hahaha - Your hero gave us all the ammunition we need too.

HYou don't know who my heroes are stupid one.

The door swings both ways, short-sighted one.

When has the RNC sold secrets to the Chinese?

If Republicans believed in Karma they would not behave as they do.

Get it through your head. Your boy was caught time and time again with his hand in the cookie jar. Please stop trying to smear us with your dirt.


Name:   ET
To:   Reality

In response to:
once again it's "evul rightwingurz" fault when the DNC tries to foist upon the public a candidate that the media knew had a long history of adultery and shady financial dealings but chose to instead to target the incumbent President with bogus stories about a weak economy and prop up the big eared troll Ross Perot.

Message:
Huh? Very confusing paragraph here ..."a long history of shady financial dealings" -- that's Bush and his Harken insider trading scheme.

Then you follow up with ..."prop up the big eared troll Ross Perot"... what's that got to do with anything?

Then you add into the confusion ..."a long history of adultery"... Yes, Clinton couln't control his zipper that's for sure, but that's his wife's problem, not yours. Seriously, does his infidelity mean the Republicans must launch a 10 year, $80 million witchunt to try and bring down the presidency, embarrass us in front of the world, destroy us as respectable nation in front of the world, and keep us glued to the media that continually fed us new angles on blowjobs and coverups while the rest of the world was crying for our attention.?

Is this the way for the only superpower in the world to behave? Have you no way of stepping back to see that a 10-year persecution of the Clinton's because of his adultery and coverup is insane? Have you no way of climbing out of your partisan mind to see that the Washington insiders became victims of a group insanity (psychologists have a name for a whole group going insane).

If you could get out of your partisan mind for one minute and tell me whether you truly believe the whole country should be drawn into a continuous 8-year bombardment of their president's sexual conduct to the exclusion of all else that is going on in the world? Do you really believe this is right?

Please don't come back with a relative-morality excuse: "if the president is bad we can be worse" Just tell me, as a responsible member of a country this is the only superpower in this world, is this the way to behave? What good did it do? How did it help the world? How did it help America?

If you can't get out of your partisan mind to see this persecution from a different perspective, then imagine if France was the only superpower in the world and they spent all of their time persecuting their president for some personal wrongdoing while we were being attacked by terrorists who invaded our country, slaughtered our citizens and took over our land. Imagine yourself appealing to France for help but you couldn't get your message through because their media was so focused on the petty infidelity of their president.


Name:   .
In response to:
Hahaha - Your hero gave us all the ammunition we need too.

Message:
Nero fiddled whilst Rome burned...


Name:   Reality
To:   ET

Message:
Fact: The Economy under BushI was not severely damaged

Fact: Ross Perot was an idiot propped and displayed as a "real" contender

Fact: The press knew that Gennifer Flowers hada long term affair with the candidate Clinton, if he were a Republican, the story would've played daily for weeks and he would have been forced out of the race.

Fact:How many "working Americans" poured their lifesavings into Castle Grande and recieved nothing? Fact: George Soros was a major investor in Harken Energy, Isuppose that makes him a member of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy too


Name:   Reality
To:   ET

In response to:
Please don't come back with a relative-morality excuse: "if the president is bad we can be worse" Just tell me, as a responsible member of a country this is the only superpower in this world, is this the way to behave? What good did it do? How did it help the world? How did it help America?

Message:
So pray tell me how does moveon.org's Bush=hitler ad help America's image?

Do our neighbours feel confidence in a superpower that repeats completely discredited lunatic rantings from the opposition party like the "past election was a coup de'tat"?

Is the answer for our press to bury any news that would contradict their ipso dixit indictments against the current administration?

Richard Clarke recieved massive coverage when he lied under oath...then zero coverage when the 9-11 commission and his own book discredited his testimony.

Joe Wilson...completely discredited, again because it might redeem the President no coverage.

Want to talk about WMD? how about 20 banned missile engines found in a Jordanian scrapyard? Did Brokaw, Rather or Jennings cover it?


Name:   Jim
To:    Tarty fools

Message:
Well, let me tell you something lord of flies. If you are ever looking for a running partner in politics, I am your man. I’ll fucking slap some old crusty senator across his lying face with his own filibustering documents and then strangle him with the American flag. It would be a suitable demise for most of those drunk fucks. You and I, Lord of Flies. You and I...


Name:   Reality
To:   ET

Message:
Imagine you're a member of the military, you know your President loathes you, he's cut the budget to the bone...introduced "social engineering" and "political correctness" PLUS extended deployments and reduced training.

Now, you're overseas and his VP's lawyers are doing their level best to throw out YOUR vote because it doesn't have a postmark.

FACT:MILITARY MAIL IN FORWARD ZONES DOESN'T REQUIRE A #@%&* POSTMARK, IT NEVER HAS!


Name:   NuTone
Message:
The Lost Angeles Times' account of Arnold's speech yesterday is unintentionally hilarious and also illustrative of the teeth-grinding, utterly humorless state into which the Kerry-Moore Democrats have sunk, including their west cost branch. Yes, Arnold jokes with crowd about "terminating" his opponents on "Judgment Day," November 2nd, and about the "girly men" he has to deal with in Sacramento, and the Times ran off to the scolds in Sacramento and got their outraged reactions. "These are the kind of statements that ought not to come out of the mouth" of the governor, exclaims Assembly Speaker, Fabian Nunez, best known for recently denying Vietnam POW Jeremiah Denton the courtesy of the Assembly floor for a Fourth of July speech. State Senator Sheila Kuehl --for those readers new to California politics, Sheila as "Zelda" on Dobie Gilllis a thousand years ago, and is a pretty smart but hard left legislator and -- went right over the p.c. cliff: "It's really painful to hear the governor resot top such blatant homophobia. It's an old fashioned way of talking about gay men as to indicate they're not as strong. So that part is really painful." Sorry, Sheila, but the SNL routine is so deeply entrenched in America humor it is like arguing that Tiger Woods playing Bill Murray's role as the groundskeeper from Caddy Shack, as he did not long ago in a a very funny sequence, is anit-animal rights. The public's not going to buy that, or Eleanor Smeal's hand-wringing that Arnold has "denigrate[d] half the human race." Even the old socialist John Burton, who routinely makes sailors blush with his invective, called himself "nonplused." I would have bet that Burton had never before heard of the word nunplused. Another reason to vote against the Kerry-Moore types at the federal and state level in November: The complete humorlessness and total self-regard of this bunch is impossible to imagine enduring for 48 months.


Name:   NuTone
Re:   Link Error
Message:

The Lost Angeles Times' account of Arnold's speech yesterday is unintentionally hilarious and also illustrative of the teeth-grinding, utterly humorless state into which the Kerry-Moore Democrats have sunk, including their west cost branch.  Yes, Arnold jokes with crowd about "terminating" his opponents on "Judgment Day," November 2nd, and about the "girly men" he has to deal with in Sacramento, and the Times ran off to the scolds in Sacramento and got their outraged reactions.  "These are the kind of statements that ought not to come out of the mouth" of the governor, exclaims Assembly Speaker, Fabian Nunez, best known for recently denying Vietnam POW Jeremiah Denton the courtesy of the Assembly floor for a Fourth of July speech.  State Senator Sheila Kuehl --for those readers new to California politics, Sheila as "Zelda" on Dobie Gilllis a thousand years ago, and is a pretty smart but hard left legislator and -- went right over the p.c. cliff:  "It's really painful to hear the governor resot top such blatant homophobia.  It's an old fashioned way of talking about gay men as to indicate they're not as strong. So that part is really painful."  Sorry, Sheila, but the SNL routine is so deeply entrenched in America humor it is like arguing that Tiger Woods playing Bill Murray's role as the groundskeeper from Caddy Shack, as he did not long ago in a a very funny sequence, is anit-animal rights.  The public's not going to buy that, or Eleanor Smeal's hand-wringing that Arnold has "denigrate[d] half the human race."  Even the old socialist John Burton, who routinely makes sailors blush with his invective, called himself "nonplused." I would have bet that Burton had never before heard of the word nunplused.

Another reason to vote against the Kerry-Moore types at the federal and state level in November:  The complete humorlessness and total self-regard of this bunch is impossible to imagine enduring for 48 months.


Name:   pie man
To:   Frumpy old broads with dusty

Re:   five-dollar-a-bottle white zin
Message:
During the beginning of 2003 I was forced to listen to all the hippy es out there nearly themselves in fits of liberalism screaming about how innocent Iraqis were dying. Then I had to endure similar ing about Liberia, about how all those poor people over there were dying and living under tyranny and how we should have had to go over there and help them out. Ironically, I’m sure that if we had gotten any more involved than we did, these same whiners would have started ing about how we were either killing innocents or infringing upon their rights. But I’m here today to let you know that it’s okay to kill these people because their combined lives are worth less than your car!

Oh, haha, no no no. You got me all wrong. I didn’t come to this conclusion, you did, Mr. Hippy! See, something occurred to me the other day when I went to the carwash and saw some goofy pull his 2003 Volkswagen Bug with a “War is not the Answer” bumper sticker into the automatic bay and order a deluxe wash. Here was the classic Liberal, driving a new car worth $20,000, and taking the time and money to get it washed up all nice and pretty. This guy was easily the incarnation of every outspoken liberal who ed about the killing of innocents in Iraq and who later ed about the poor people of Liberia, and then ed again about the poor Iraqis. So I’m sitting there in my car, wondering if there is a way I can slash his tires without getting caught when it occurs to me that his car is worth more than the combined value of dozens, if not hundreds of Iraqi and Liberian lives. He paid 20,000 bucks for his car, he probably puts Silver or Premium gas in it ‘cause he looks like that kind of putz (gas that he buys at low prices thanks to the actions of our conservative Chief Executive) and he goes to car washes where he purchases the deluxe packages.

Here we have the combined value of 10 dirty Somalians. Pretty, isn't it?

When it’s all said and done, this has spent the twenty grand initially to get the car and then probably two or three thousand bucks a year to maintain it. Think of how many people he could save with some sort of “Sponsor an Arab” organization. A twenty grand buy-in plus a few grand a year could save a lot of lives. He could have forgone his personal luxury and sent food, water and medical care to Iraq. Hell, he could have single handedly paid for the relocation of several Baghdad families out of harms way in 2003. But did he? No. So why not?

See this Iraqi ? Yeah, your car is worth more than her life 10 times over. In between mouthfuls of tofu maybe you can explain this to her, -a-hole.

Well, if we go by generally accepted laws of economics, it is because he got more value out of the purchase of his car. Economic theory says that we will always spend our money on what gives us the most utility or usefulness. Obviously, he has decided that his car is more important than the lives of a dozen people living in Iraq or Liberia. So why is he ing so much about foreign policy when it is obvious that his car is more important to him? , I don’t know. If anything, shouldn’t he be ing about something car related since that part of his life is evidently at the forefront of his mind? And what is even more confusing is that there are approximately 120 million Liberals in this country. Let’s guess that 80 million of them have cars. If each of them really cared about those poor, under-privileged people in Iraq and Liberia, they could all sell their cars and each save a dozen people. This would be 960 million people saved! Almost a sixth of the world population! That is the combined populace of Iraq and Liberia six times over! Holy ! We have a solution!

Okay, hippies, go out and sell your cars. Then use the money to save people! Listen, I just want to thank the hippies out there who have brought this confusing issue to my attention. At first I thought you were all just hypocrites, driving around in your Bugs, Minis and Volvos, spending absurd amounts of money on luxury items while you ed unproductively about the sad predicament of other cultures. But in reality, you all just hadn’t come up with a solution yet.

Well, I’m glad to have helped by providing a viable means to ameliorate this source of tension and contention. I expect to see a lot less traffic in the near future. You’re welcome.


Name:   Scroll Mouse
Re:   John Kerry has friends too
Message:


Sharon: French Jews 'must move to Israel'

Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon has urged

 all French Jews to move to Israel immediately

to escape anti-Semitism.

Desecrated tombstone at a French Jewish cemetery in April 2003

 

 

He told a meeting of the American Jewish Association in Jerusalem that Jews around the world should relocate to Israel as early as possible.

France has seen a spate of attacks against Jewish targets     

But for those living in France, he added, moving was a "must" because of rising violence against Jews there.

France's foreign ministry said it had asked Israel for an explanation of the "unacceptable comments".

French Jewish leaders, interviewed on France-2 Television, said Mr Sharon's remarks were unhelpful.

"These comments do not bring calm, peace and serenity that we all need," said Patrick Gaubert, of the International League Against Racism and Anti-Semitism (Licra). "I think Mr Sharon would have done better tonight to have kept quiet."

"It's not up to him to decide for us," said Theo Klein, honorary president of Crif, which represents French Jewish organisations.

Trend

France has suffered a wave of anti-Semitic attacks coinciding with renewed fighting in the Middle East.

Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon
About France, on one hand we see the spread of the wildest anti-Semitism there
Ariel Sharon

"We see the spread of the wildest anti-Semitism" in France, Mr Sharon said.

The latest French government figures show 510 anti-Jewish acts or threats in the first six months of 2004 - compared to 593 for all of last year.

In recent years there have been bomb attacks against a number of synagogues and Jewish schools in France.

Jewish tombs have also been desecrated.

Mr Sharon acknowledged that the Paris government had made efforts to tackle the problem.

He added that France faced a new kind of anti-Semitism based on anti-Israeli feelings and propaganda.

He pointed out that France had a large Muslim community estimated at less than 10% of population, or about five million.

Hoax

Mr Sharon said his advice to French Jews was that moving to Israel was "a must and they have to move immediately".

The BBC's Hugh Schofield in Paris says this is not the first time that Mr Sharon has spoken about the need for French Jews to leave for Israel, but rarely has he been so blunt.

"We have immediately made contact with Israeli authorities to ask them for explanations about these unacceptable statements," said French foreign ministry spokesman Herve Ladsous.

Our correspondent says there is irritation in France at the idea that life for Jews there is becoming dangerous - especially as the government has made every effort to show that anti-Jewish acts will be severely punished.

A week ago President Jacques Chirac rushed to condemn an apparently anti-Semitic attack on a Paris train that turned out to be a hoax.

Our correspondent adds that his haste only aggravated passions among many in the Muslim community who feel they are the instant scapegoats.

 


Name:   Forum Related?
Message:

MERYL STREEP:

I'M NOT PLAYING HILLARY...


Name:   Scroll Mouse
Message:

Paris slams Sharon for urging Jews to quit France

PARIS, July 18 (Reuters) - France sharply criticised Israeli Prime Minister Ariel Sharon on Sunday after he urged French Jews to emigrate immediately to Israel to escape what he called "the wildest anti-Semitism."

Branding Sharon's language "unacceptable," a French Foreign Ministry spokesman said Paris had demanded an explanation.

France, home to western Europe's biggest Jewish and Muslim communities, has been troubled by attacks on Jewish people and property in recent years, some of it blamed on youths of North African origin angered by the Israeli-Palestinian conflict.

Sharon, who regularly calls on all the world's Jews to migrate to Israel, acknowledged in a speech to Jewish leaders in Jerusalem that the French government was making efforts to stem anti-Semitism. But he added that the threat was so grave that French Jews should head for Israel without delay.

"If I have to advise our brothers in France, I'll tell them one thing -- move to Israel, as early as possible. I say that to Jews all around the world, but there (in France) I think it's a must and they have to move immediately," Sharon said.

The French spokesman said: "We have been informed of comments made today by Sharon calling on the Jews of France to emigrate to Israel.

"We immediately made contact with the Israeli authorities to ask for an explanation of these unacceptable comments."

In an attempt to smooth over tension with Paris, a spokesman for Sharon said the prime minister had praised France for its "strong stance against anti-Semitism."

"The prime minister admits, however, that the widespread anti-Semitism in France is due to the demographic factor, that there is a large Muslim populace who are hostile to Israel," the spokesman Raanan Gissin said.

"He is not telling them to flee because of anti-Semitism, rather that this should be a contributing factor (for emigration)," Gissin said, adding Sharon called on all Jews to move to Israel so they could live "a full Jewish life."

Some 600,000 Jews and five million Muslims form part of France's population of 60 million.

The French Interior Ministry registered 67 attacks on Jews or their property and 160 threats against Jews in the first quarter of this year compared with 42 attacks and 191 threats in the last three months of 2003.


Name:   Individual
In response to:
Clinton himself could've stopped the entire mess by A)Not signing the independent counsel statute B) keeping it in his pants C)not perjuring himself D)settling it quietly E) firing Ken Starr F)Not lying to the nation and wagging his finger at us.

Message:
If you think any of these things would have "stopped the entire mess," I have some great canyonland properties in northern Arizona I would like to sell you.


Name:   Individual LIES EXPOSED!
In response to:
If you think any of these things would have "stopped the entire mess," I have some great canyonland properties in northern Arizona I would like to sell you.

Message:
Liar!

Individual would get his arse kicked if she set foot in Arizona.


Name:   Shoob Tigerbalmer
To:   Scotty Weezers

Re:   Yer gin-soaker Mommer
In response to:
: Funny little toff..............

Message:
You should have seen the rest of it before the Hall Proctor got to it!


Name:   All
To:   ET

Re:   Hillary is too rich to give a damn anymore.
In response to:
High-pitched screeching

Message:
Just go ahead and VOTE FOR KERRY. You know you can't help yourself. Israel is going down regardless. Kerry will accellerate the inevitable, and he will tell YOU it is all Rush Limbaugh's fault, and you will blame Bush and be comforted.


Name:   Milan
Re:   NY Times hits bottoms and keeps digging
In response to:
1) No, I don't think the readers of "Glorious Appearing" will ram planes into buildings. But we did imprison thousands of Muslims here and abroad after 9/11, and ordinary Americans joined in the torture of prisoners at Abu Ghraib in part because of a lack of empathy for the prisoners.

2) If a Muslim were to write an Islamic version of "Glorious Appearing" and publish it in Saudi Arabia, jubilantly describing a massacre of millions of non-Muslims by God, we would have a fit.

Message:
1) What kind of adult is so confused as to make moral equivalency statements between the biggest act of terrorism in America, and the unprofessional behaviour of a few soldiers towards presumed insurgeants who were mostly guilty as sin?

Better yet, what kind of newspaper would publish this?

Scarier yet, how big is the audience that is going to praise this crap?

.

2) Mr. Kristoff's lack moral maturity is almost matched by his abyssmal ignorance of what is being taught in the Arab world AMIDST THE SORDID INDIFFERENCE OF MOST LIBERALS.

The basic difference between the intolerance taught by Christian fundamentalists and their so-called Muslim "counterparts" is that the "Left Behind" fans do not partake of this final judgement. This duty is left for GOD.

WHERE ARE THE MARCHING ORDERS FOR CHRISTIANS TO KILL NON-CHRISTIANS!?

.

We have spent much time diplaying what MEMRI has exposed on what is taught in the Arab world. So let me give you all a sample what Muslims are learing in America (courtesy of the Muslim Studet Union website):

.

The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and His Messenger, and strive with might and main for mischief through the land is: execution, or crucifixion, or the cutting off of hands and feet from opposite sides (Q 5:33)

I will instill terror into the hearts of the unbelievers: smite ye above their necks and smite all their finger-tips off them (Q 8:12)

But when the forbidden months are past, then fight and slay the Pagans wherever ye find them, and seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem. (Q 9:5)

Fight those who believe not in Allah nor the Last Day, nor hold that forbidden which hath been forbidden by Allah and His Messenger, nor acknowledge the religion of Truth, (even if they are) of the People of the Book, until they pay the Jizya with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued. (Q 9:29)

(http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/)

Bukhari, volume 9, #17

"Narrated Abdullah: Allah's Messenger said, "The blood of a Muslim who confesses that none has the right to be worshipped but Allah and that I am His Messenger, cannot be shed except in three cases: in Qisas (equality in punishment) for murder, a married person who commits illegal sexual intercourse and the one who reverts from Islam (Apostate) and leaves the Muslims."

http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/fundamentals/hadithsunnah/bukhari/083.sbt.html

Bukhari, volume 9, #57

"Whoever changed his Islamic religion, then kill him."

http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/fundamentals/hadithsunnah/bukhari/084.sbt.html


Name:   Malcolm Bumpkin
To:   Voice On High

Re:   Kerry Is The Last Hope Of Mankind!
In response to:
Is this the way for the only superpower in the world to behave? Have you no way of stepping back to see that a 10-year persecution of the Clinton's because of his adultery and coverup is insane? Have you no way of climbing out of your partisan mind to see that the Washington insiders became victims of a group insanity (psychologists have a name for a whole group going insane).

Message:
Everyone on earth is insane except you, the Clintons, and Paul Krugman.


Name:   partofVRWC
Message:
The 'Middleization' of American politics. Kerry has always been a 'Liberal', this is an established fact by his years of Voting in the US Senate. What we are hearing now from John Kerry?, words like Preemptive, Selected Tax Cuts, Govt downsizing. GW was the 'Compassionate Conservatve' (I must have money, I still got checks left). Even as Gov of Texas he did things that alienated his conservative BASE, but still, a better alternative to uber liberal Ann Richards (Endearing, Intelligent women,though) just kept raising taxes to pay for all the socialist programs. Education is still a mess in Texas. When GW was elected on his 'Uniter not a Divider' campaign he quickly realized that he was gonna have to move nore center (just like Bill Clinton from the Left), to work with the congress and not alienate the Democrats by continuing the legal manevers against the Clintons. The Education debacle with Ted Kennedy was proof he was moving away from his conservative roots, after all 'Reelection' is always on a policians mind. His 'reaching out' to Democrats got him nowhere his first year in office and then 911. He was a man that knew what had to be done in order for this country to continue to survive an onslaught of Radical Islamist. No POLLS necassary. This is the part that scares the Liberals the most. If reelected, he'll have 4 years to do what he was elected to do, Less Govt, Less Taxes, Less Govt programs, Less Regulations, Judges that dispense Laws, continue to protect this country from people that want to destroy it (Jihadist) maybe he won't work with Kennedy on the Next Education Bill.. Pres. Clinton had a golden opportunity his second term but was so 'dogged' by his extraciriculum affairs he got nothing (or little) done. The best thing about all of this is....Surely The DNC will rethink their party and objectives and offer Americans a 'Viable' alternative (canadites) after they lose this election cycle, also. I want a choice, a debate. I miss the 2 party system we, as Americans, use to have. Just my 2 cents.


Name:   Emmanuel Van Mousse
To:   French Pousseypot

Re:   More Toadspittle
In response to:
France's foreign ministry said it had asked Israel for an explanation of the "unacceptable comments".

Message:
Fruck you, Froggy!


Name:   Old Euro-Mouse
To:   French Toast w/Jellyfish Jelly

Re:   Gary the Snail-Cat
Message:
They are NOT our friends. They are NOT our allies. Kerry, deep down in his heart knows this as well


Name:   Eat Me
To:   Hacker

Message:
I'm a silly little nance socialist..........come get me you bad rightwing stud.......


Name:   observer
To:   forum

Re:   france and jews
Message:
Isn't this great? Those wonderful, humane, tolerant French don't want Jews in their country any more. Why did my father bother to airdrop small arms and medical supplies to Free French operatives in 1944? Did Vichy finally win? I think that it would be fitting to kick the UN out of New York and re-open it in Paris, where the traitors and collaborators from around the world will feel right at home. Besides, we wouldn't have to send a representative to them any more just to save face. Zieg Heil mon ami..............


Name:   Gary Yost
To:   Dirty jews

In response to:
Paris slams Sharon for urging Jews to quit France

Message:
All jews must be destroyed and killed.


Name:   terry the cork
To:   forum

Re:   Kerry
Message:
So Kerry is a Viet Nam vet.....for which side?


Name:   joe the wiseass
To:   forum

Re:   Sharon's remark
Message:
This is definite proof that Jews are smarter than the French. I'm sorry if I insulted the Jews with that observation. I mean, it really isn't saying much......


Name:   American
To:   YOM

Re:   The Other White People
In response to:
They are NOT our friends. They are NOT our allies. Kerry, deep down in his heart knows this as well

Message:
Kerry is one of them, not one of us.


Name:   Dissident Nguyen Dan Que
To:   Vietnamese revolution

In response to:
So Kerry is a Viet Nam vet.....for which side?

Message:
The Winning side fool!


Name:   Jimmy
To:   Friends of Kerry

Message:
I heard the Indochine Hotel in Saigon is a nice friendly boutique hotel. Will be there from 26 July and there seems to be very little reviews or comments on this hotel. I can't even find a picture of the hotel on the net. Please help if you have information on the Indochine hotel in Saigon. I thank you in advance for your great help.


Name:   Joppi & Keck
Re:   The French
In response to:
This is definite proof that Jews are smarter than the French. I'm sorry if I insulted the Jews with that observation. I mean, it really isn't saying much......

Message:
The Jews are a great deal smarter than the French. At one time, the French were a little bit smarter than the Neanderthal. They were much more treacherous, though. That was always their main strength. Now, after years of Socialism, they are just about finished. They are being absorbed and over-written by the Muslims, and they don't even realize it.


Name:   HLVMF
In response to:
"Whoever changed his Islamic religion, then kill him."

Message:
Bring it on, sand n|gger....we'll see who f*cking kills who.


Name:   Jimmy
Message:

Me cruzin the red light districts for young boyz...


Name:   Jimmy
To:   Yummy

Message:


Name:   Megar Sye
Message:
The rally for the SLA in a pie-shaped corner of Ho Chi Minh Park on June 2 had a rather odd sense of nostalgia. Some of the best-known Berkeley radicals were there, but they skirted the edges of the disappointing crowd, looking for a familiar face from anti-Vietnam War days. Some of them carried infants in their arms. They still had that Berkeley style of rough-hewn casual clothes, heavy boots. From a nearby building, the FBI filmed the gathering.

Someone lined up bottles of Acadama Plum Wine along the front of the stage, a memorial gesture to Field Marshal Cinque’s penchant. The speakers, mosly in their early twenties, eulogized the SLA dead. Rudy Henderson was there and spoke lovingly of Ling Perry. But no one who spoke said he had Cin, or even Patricia Hearst. The only person who knew one of the SLA was the blond, jut-jawed organizer, twenty-seven-year-old Kathy Soliah.

Soliah had worked with Angela Atwood at Great Electric Underground restaurant, a businessman’s luncheon retreat in the basement of the world headquarters of the Bank of America in San Francisco. They both had acting ambitions and both quit their jobs at the restaurant in 1973 because their boss insisted they wear brief, ruffled skirts with V tops to titillate the bored afternoon clientele of bankers and brokers. Angela went from that job to her first encounters with DeFreeze in those days when the SLA was writing its Declaration of Revolutionary War. Kathy waited until the first series of SLA communiqués began appearing after Hearst’s kidnapping before joining with a few others in the formation of the Bay Area Research Collective. At first, BARC devoted to exposing by memoranda the corrupt dealings of large corporations and government. But gradually, BARC also came to be a conduit for new underground groups like the New World Liberation Front, who

needed a safe means of "cleaning" and disseminating their communiqués so they could not be traced. Wearing sunglasses, her hands clasped around the front shoulder strip of her purse, Soliah eulogized the courage

of her dead friend. And then she announced simply, "I am a soldier of the SLA." Some in the crowd cheered. One or two reporters raised their eyebrows, but nearly everyone took it as a symbolic gesture. Months later, newspapers would sift through their files for the picture of Soliah standing on the platform that day and publish it with more resounding speculation. It was weeks. after the picture had appeared over and over again that someone noticed the middle-aged woman with her arms crossed standing in the crowd behind Soliah, cheering her speech; it was Sara Jane Moore.

The FBI had already invested enormous resources in their search for Patricia Hearst and the SLA. Special Agent in Charge Charles Bates had been involved in some major cases, including the assassination of President John Kennedy and the Watergate cover-up, but be had never marshaled so elaborate an investigative army. But, like almost everyone else in the crowd that day, bureau agents paid no special attention to Kathy Soliah’s declaration.

Mizmoon Soltysik had brought in Camilla Hall, Angela Atwood was recruited by the Harrises; Russ Little attracted Nancy Ling Perry, and on and on The links were stronger personally than politically. Thus it was important that day in Ho Chi Minh Park that Kathy Soliah declared herself a close friend of Angela Atwood. For Angela had had a close relationship with the Harrises ever since the days they were all students at the University of Indiana.

Soliah eventually would involve her sister Josephine and her brother Steven with the couple associated with her friend Angela. And they all would link up with Patty Hearst. The rally that day also brought the trio together with sports activist Jack Scott and a circle of his trusted friends, Including Wendy Yoshimura.

Kathy Soliah’s was similar to those of SLA members. The second oldest of five children born to Palmdale, California, high school teacher—coach Martin Soliah and his wife Elsie, she was popular in high school. An honor student, president of the Pep Club, Kathy earned a degree in education at the University of California at Santa Barbara and while there met and fell in love with James Kilgore, gangly, free-spirited son of a well-off San Rafael, California, businessman. Kilgore would change Soliah’s life. She

with him first to live at what her parents complained was a commune in Southern California. In 1972 Kilgore and Soliah, both twenty-four, moved on

to Berkeley. Despite her degree and her ambition to be an actress, like so many others of her generation in Berkeley, she never found a job that could be said to match her education.


Name:   Cornflower Eyes
To:   Jimmy

In response to:
Mud Boyz

Message:
I saw you under the big tree in Beastmaster. That was so cool!


Name:   Megar Sye
To:    II

Re:   Vote Kerry
Message:
Had FBI agents checked the of Kathy Soliah they would have found that in 1973 she frequently visited Willy Brandt, an inmate at Soledad

Prison. Kilgore had been a character witness at Braunt’s trial. Brandt and two companions—Michael Bortin and Paul Rubenstein had been arrested in

1972 and charged with illegal possession of explosives.

They had been arrested when Berkeley police, acting on a tip from neighbors, raided a garage and found the cache. They also seized Brandt’s girlfriend’s Volkswagen and in the glove compartment found an unsent

-communiqué claiming credit for the allegedly planned bombing of the Naval ROTC building at UC Berkeley. The communiqué, a stylistic forerunner of those later sent by the SLA, was signed by the "Red Army." The owner of the Volkswagen, an indicted coconspirator in the plot, was not apprehended. She was Wendy Yoshimura.

Brandt was convicted and sentenced to ten years in prison. Rubenstein and Bortin served brief jail terms and were released on probation. Yoshimura slipped into the underground.

Among the people Brandt had known and admired while at Berkeley was former track star Jack Scott,who had a Ph.D. in philosophy. An unconventional

athletics coach, the balding Scott was something of an anti-establishment sports celebrity by the tune he was assigned the directorship of the sports program at Oberlin College in 1973. There he confounded the sports establishment by hiring black coaches, including Tommie Smith, who, along with John Carlos, had been censured for wearing black socks and raising their fists, in the black-power salute on the winner’s stand during the 1968 Olympics in Mexico City. Scott attempted to de-emphasize winning even in the school’s competitive sports. His reputation as a sports activist was most solidly rooted on three controversial books he authored decrying the dehumanization of athletes in professional sports. And be and his close friend Mikki McGee founded and ran a clearing house for their radical views of American athletics. They called it the Institute for the Study of Sports and Society(1SSS).

Brandt corresponded with Scott when the latter was at Oberlin. The athletics director also persuaded a mailroom attendant to write to Brandt at Soledad. That young attendant was Jay Weiner, also an admirer and protégé of Scott’s.

Back in the Bay Area, the SLA trio was having difficulty acquiring money and shelter. They had never been able to penetrate such established groups as the Weather Underground Though the dead SLA soldiers were eulogized, those yet alive were viewed as adventurist bandits and worse. Because they were traveling with Hearst they were considered fugitives to be avoided. In their revolutionary document "Prairie Fire," the Weather Underground mentioned Joseph Remiro and Russell Little, but took no direct notice of the SLA. They appeared to condemn the army’s activity as mere provocative terrorism.

Contrary to one magazine’s "exclusive" account, the Harrises did not attend the rally that day in Ho Chi Minh Park. It would have been a singular act of derring-do. For the park blossomed with federal agents, undercover police, and FBI informants. And there were squads of news reporters with microphones picking their way through the crowd.


Name:   Jason
To:   Hillary

Message:
Im reading 'the exception to the rulers' at the moment. Very informative. Strong parallels can be drawn between 1930s germany and the US today (political repression, military agression, denoting an entire race as enemies ..i.e.jews/muslims). Nick Berg was a victim of the policies of the US government. Leave Iraq (and its oil) to the Muslims.


Name:   Jimmy
To:   Jason Dude

In response to:
reading 'the exception to the rulers' at the moment. Very informative. Strong parallels can be drawn between 1930s germany and the US today (political repression, military agression, denoting an entire race as enemies ..i.e.jews/muslims). Nick Berg

Message:
America was bulit on spilled blood, ask the Native American Elders . Ask the African American elders. ASK the Mexicans that should own this land.. During the days of Wild white West you were hung by a tree in the town square if you "rustled 'some cattle. The Clinton inquisition for a bj, LA cops, Hilter, Ghengis Khan, George W Bushwacker, Murder aint pretty folks...

Killing and war-mongering will continue untill the our planet is destroyed.Why is it that so many americans say "god bless" this "god bless" that??? how long is it going to take for people to realize that "god" isnt going to bless a damn think. And dont thank "god" either, get a backbone instead and put responsibility in the right place.

Why doesnt america undastand that if they leave muslim lands then they wont need to be slaughtered.

The only problem the 'terrorists' have is that there are western forces commiting atrocities on muslim land. If they all left and took their american imposed puppets(the leaders) with them then we can all live in peace.


Name:   Mark
To:   Jason

Re:   Mo(o)re from the Bush = Hitler Kooks
In response to:
Im reading 'the exception to the rulers' at the moment. Very informative.

Message:
So the media ignored East Timor during the 90s? Well, I don't recall the Nation or MotherJones or NPR saying much about East Timor when Indonesia invaded the place either. The war in Afghanistan?? Well, Amy's buddy, fellow traveller Sasha Cockburn said at the time of the invasion, "if ever a country deserved to be raped, that country is Afghanistan." Oh, sorry, that was in 1979, not 2001. try reading the Amsterdam News sometime, and see just what kind of journalism "the people" produce. Amy Goodman's another puritanical know-it-all and frankly, as sanctimonious and boring in print as she is on the air.


Name:   Danny American
To:   Editor

In response to:
Republicans kept Americans fixated on this modern-day witch-hunt and inquisition, while the world was suffering and the Taliban was prospering.

Message:
Exactly what was our PRESIDENT doing when it was the PRESIDENT who should have been worrying about the Taliban? We all know what he was doing. You can't move the blame to anyone else. How many Republicans committed perjury AND/OR were disbarred?


Name:   eddie
To:   Danny American

In response to:
Exactly what was our PRESIDENT doing when it was the PRESIDENT who should have been worrying about the Taliban? We all know what he was doing. You can't move the blame to anyone else. How many Republicans committed perjury AND/OR were disbarred

Message:
Socialism is truth!


Name:   jimmy
Message:
bull-shlt america has never helped anyone. they are the cause of the worlds problems..

the middle east was the most peaceful place to live in pre-1924. that was until the western forces came and corrupted it. THEN america imposed its own leaders and thats when the problems started.

if america kept their noses out of other ppls business thn it would all be ok but noooooo thy had to go and do tht didnt thy???......now they are gonna gt what they deserve.


Name:   Scotty
To:   fool

In response to:
Just go ahead and VOTE FOR KERRY. You know you can't help yourself. Israel is going down regardless. Kerry will accellerate the inevitable, and he will tell YOU it is all Rush Limbaugh's fault, and you will blame Bush and be comforted

Message:
You sir are a disgrace to America. It is sad little nationalitstic people like yourself who give the West a bad name. I am not a bad person, but people will not like me because I am british.


Name:   Scotty
To:   Forum

Message:
America is becoming a facist country. All you americans- be afraid and pay attention to how you are fed information.

If it wasnt so serious the rest of the world would be laughing. Fighting for Iraqs freedom indeed! ha! oh yeah America... get this! you lot carp on about a the UN but you still strap people down to tables and execute them in your country!! Every day!! You clever bastards. Oh dear.....it seems the Americans have got their Bruce Springsteen turned up too loud to hear what the rest of the world is try to tell them.


Name:   jimmy
To:   the peopkle

Message:
Go back to electrocuting black people and the mentally ill...as you're all too stupid to realise that your President is an idiot, who will ultimately lead you into the WWIII. He had his opportunity to change the world, when the towers were hit he COULD have thought to himself....hmmmmm the world seems pretty pissed with us, perhaps I should try to understand why - instead of saddling up, locking and loading, andturning a basically good country into the most hated nation in the world. Everyone in the world is disgusted with you, and Bush and that little a-s-s-licker of a Prime Minister.


Name:   Danny American
To:   History

In response to:
the highest home ownership in the country's history

Message:
You really need to read the CURRENT news or at least visit some websites that have current data. For several months now home ownership has been at a record high (both minorities and non-minorities). And just in case you aren't aware of this..George Bush is our president.


Name:   Premium Gut
Message:
The really weird thing...is that America has earn't it's place as the Stupidiest place in the world by contiunally repeating the same mistakes. One word VIETNAM. don't hear many the Veterans cheering your president on ....do you? mind you, your are the country who'd have body-builder movie star as a political leader, I mean really....ARNIE! is he seriously considered the most intelligent, tactical, charismatic man your 'democratic' system can produce? HE CAN"T EVEN SPELL USA!! mind you, he was great in Kindergarten Cop, and he'll be well used to dealing with a nation of children


Name:   Democrat
To:   rightwing Bush Supporters

In response to:
So pray tell me how does moveon.org's Bush=hitler ad help America's image

Message:
Travel Broadens the mind, try visiting some other nations before you try to 'sort them out' .


Name:   Gay Rob
Message:
Thank god all those innocent GI's died on the beaches of Normandy so that your generation could enjoy Jenna Jameson being spit-roasted......your Grandfathers will be smiling in their graves.


Name:   jimmy
To:   fools

In response to:
For the sweet love of Christ! Your juvenile literary manneris

Message:
try to understand your enemy: eye for an eye... you know??? as long as america and any western/christian "crusader" tries to bring "peace and freedom" to islamic countries they will defeat them and fight back. understand this: these people don´t think that they are not free... and nuking these countries will be no reason. ever heared about something called "nuclear winter" ? radioactive fallout does not seperate between "good" and "evil" between "christian" and "muslim" and everybody who´s willing to kill innocent people is as worse as any terrorist.


Name:   ....
Message:
Three times 666 passeth, Thousandfold on nations, Cometh fear and sudden death. Everywhere are lamentations, Sorrows and none are comforteth. Day by day their woes increase, Mine alone are blest with peace. For it is through numbers that God will prove his presence, And identify those who defy Him. And the Righteous shall spurn the coins that are foisted upon them.


Name:   Danny American
To:   Jimmy

In response to:
the middle east was the most peaceful place to live in pre-1924. that was until the western forces came and corrupted it. THEN america imposed its own leaders and thats when the problems started.

basically good country

Message:
Which is it "Jimmy"?? We were a "basically good country" until 9/11 or we started the problems in 1924?? Take you brain washed hate elsewhere...


Name:   turk 189
To:   danny dumb a-s -s

In response to:
You really need to read the CURRENT news or at least visit some websites that have current data. For several months now home ownership has been at a record high (both minorities and non-minorities). And just in case you aren't aware of this..George Bush is our president

Message:
Your post clearly shows that you can't without emotion discuss anything logically and intelligently.


Name:   Gat Rob
To:   jim

In response to:
between "good" and "evil" between "christian" and "muslim" and everybody who´s willing to kill innocent people is as worse

Message:
Sorry,people allow me to add this as well. Jesus of Nazareth once said, "He who lives by the sword, dies by the sword." One is not meant to fight, even for self defense. Gandhiji would not strike a man if he was hit first. Mahummad preached as well, that an eye for an eye would leave us blind. Oh yeah! Moses (the Jew!) was the one to deliver the 10 commandments (Thou shalt not kill!) Holy war is an oxymoron. War is a product of hate, ignorance, or greed. Not religion.


Name:   Bush Supporter
To:   forum funny people

Message:
Do your cars run on oil or bullsh1t? cause if they run on bull most of you could drive around the world for the rest of your lives!


Name:   Scotty
To:   Forum

Message:

USA is a trully chaotic country...


Name:   jimmy
To:   danny boy

In response to:
Which is it "Jimmy"?? We were a "basically good country" until 9/11 or we started the problems in 1924?? Take you brain washed hate elsewhere...

Message:
As long as we (usa) have a president like "W" .....this will never end!


Name:   Danny American
To:   Premium "Jimmy" Gut

In response to:
don't hear many the Veterans cheering your president on ....do you?

Message:
http://vets4bush.com/

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/06/04/opinion/polls/main621136.shtml

http://wfrv.com/topstories/topstories_story_156140220.html

http://www.gopusa.com/news/2004/june/0601_poll_veterans_bush.shtml

Let me ask you a question. Do you live in this country? If you do, why? You're free to go. If not, SHUT UP!


Name:   Scotty
To:    DUH

In response to:
Do your cars run on oil or bullsh1t? cause if they run on bull most of you could drive around the world for the rest of your lives

Message:
Your pride is stronger than your common sense. Do you honestly think we are there to play footsie? We are there because we stand to gain from it. No matter if the oil plays a role. We ARE THERE BECAUSE IT BENEFITS US. Even if you seclude yourself to the view of we help other people. In that case, it makes us look good, right?

Bush is not Hitler. Bush with the power of rule Hitler had is Hitler


Name:   Danny American
To:   turk 189

In response to:
dumb a-s -s

Message:
And that was logical and intelligent? Thanks for playing.


Name:   Scotty
To:   Danny American

In response to:
http://wfrv.com/topstories/topstories_story_156140220.html http://www.gopusa.com/news/2004/june/0601_poll_veterans_bush.shtml Let me ask you a question. Do you live in this country? If you do, why? You're free to go. If not, SHUT UP!

Message:
Wake up and stop being so war crazy, its sick that i have to worry about my future and safety because some jerk that i sure as he